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Keep Android Open

keepandroidopen.org

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Re: Keep Android Open

#591

Post by grepex »

zikduruqe wrote: post #238
willtemperley wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looks like GrapheneOS will be available on another "major Android OEM” soon [1]. Regulation should prevent Google from subsidising manufacturers to use Android. Arguably the recent antitrust legislation [2] applies in this case because they're effectively paying manufacturers to place that horrendous and impossible to remove search bar on the home screen. [1] https://www.androidauthority.com/graphene-os-major-android…

> Looks like GrapheneOS will be available on another "major Android OEM” soon. I'm secretly hoping that this will be Framework or Nothing.

Could either of those be considered a major Android OEM? I was thinking Motorola.

Re: Keep Android Open

#592

Post by charcircuit »

fsflover wrote: post #459
rbits wrote: post #432

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://madaidans-insecurities.github.io/linux.html

It's a different approach to security. There are no malicious apps in GNU/Linux repositories. (And yes, Linux security should be improved; I run Qubes on desktop) https://source.puri.sm/Librem5/docs/community-wiki/-/wikis/F...

>It's a different approach to security

That's like saying using a hole in a wall is a different approach to security than putting a lockable door in a wall. Sure no security is s different approach to security, but it's not an effective one.

>There are no malicious apps in GNU/Linux repositories

Maybe not intentionally malicous, but there have been bugs that can cause applications to act maliciously such as deleting users files. If an application gets exploited it could also do malicous things. Just because you trust the author of a program, that doesn't mean that sanboxing is pointless. Additionally programs like the terminal are a free for the user to run things like curl | sh which can run malware infecting the system and run wild since there is no security to stop it from doing almost anything.

>Purism

The wiki page pretty much says that they don't have privacy or security and don't have the resources to implement such features unlike Google or Apple. They also make some claims to try and pretend their platform is secure and private in order to help sell the Librem 5, a product they made with inferior privacy and security compared to Android.

Re: Keep Android Open

#593

Post by qwytw »

liendolucas wrote: post #283

I'm going to say something that probably will get me down votes: Why do we have to beg Google to keep Android open? Seriously. So many open source projects have risen out of real and concrete needs and successfully made their way into our every day lives. A new platform needs to rise that breaks out completely from Google. I've given PostmarketOS a go (with a PinePhone) and while today I can't say it isn't a daily dr…

> So many open source projects have risen out of real and concrete needs and successfully made their way into our every day lives.

When it comes to consumer hardware or software targeted at end users? I think such cases are pretty rare and far in between. Firefox had a brief stint of being popular in the late 2000s, Valve is doing some cool stuff with SteamOS/Proton but I can't think of much else of the the top of my head.

Otherwise it's usually companies like Google or Apple which use OSS as a base layer for their closed down and proprietary platforms.

PostmarketOS is cool but its a product niche targeted a very tiny subset of consumers (just like Linux on desktop for that matter).

Re: Keep Android Open

#594

Post by bluGill »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #376
state_less wrote: post #356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Back in '99 Linux didn't run Excel/Word/Powerpoint or most games, but I ran it anyway. What others call showstoppers are for me inconveniences. I have a motorolla edge 2024 that I'll load whatever open source phone OS will work well enough to place calls and browse the web. I'll keep another phone for the rare times some corporate/government overlord requires it. Many folks who refuse to use smartphones, similarly ow…

Technology has a ratchet effect at scale - as a solution becomes widely adopted, it switches from being a convenience to being a necessity, because people start building more stuff on top of it. It's as true of to-the-minute accurate clocks as it is of smartphone banking. You can still run a version of Word from 2004. It's fine, if all you need is to write some thoughts down for yourself. But the moment you need to c…

Which is why we need to ban together. Libreoffice isn't dominate, but it has enough market share that it can't be completely ignored. Also if you are using it you are not alone - you are an annoying deviation, but there are enough of you that many cannot ignore you. The more people who also use libreoffice the more power we have. If we can get to just 5% market share we cannot be ignored. (it need not be libreoffice, there are other choices that support that file format well enough which is what we care about.)

Re: Keep Android Open

#595

Post by echelon_musk »

mistercheph wrote: post #528
echelon_musk wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good luck funding the development of a competing mobile OS by FLOSS nerds that can compete with Google's trillion dollar market cap. Even if you could get some traction, you're gonna have a bad time getting banks to support this OS, at which point it will be useless for most users, preventing you from ever becoming profitable.

Linux, linux, linux, if you’re blackpilled keep it to yourself, contributes nothing.

Like many others in this thread have already said, Linux is not the solution.

You call it blackpilling, I call it facing reality.

Re: Keep Android Open

#596

Post by pqtyw »

pjerem wrote: post #371
fooqux wrote: post #358

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"just use a second phone" cannot be the answer because 99% of people will just scoff at that. Instead of buying a second phone, why not just buy one that works? And that's to say nothing of the environmental impact.

> "just use a second phone" cannot be the answer because 99% of people will just scoff at that. Here we are talking about installing PostmarketOS/Linux on a smartphone. The next milestone is not to get everyone on it. First we need a base of early adopters that are willing to use it despite the drawbacks. The more user those alternatives will get, the more they will be developed, the better it will get. Sure, for the…

> it. First we need a base of early adopters that are willing to use it despite the drawbacks.

That didn't work that well for Linux, though. It's still a very niche OS even on desktop.

Re: Keep Android Open

#597

Post by grepex »

gf000 wrote: post #271
andrepd wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Before buying a smartphone I tried to find an inexpensive model that supports open source OS, but I couldn't. What open OS support is ether expensive Pixels, or outdated models. You can buy a refurbished Pixel 5 for less than 200$. Great screen, great camera, 5G, the works. It's definitely not an "outdated" device, and it runs Graphene or Lineage with minimal hassle.

You can get a new Pixel 8 for ~500$, I would say that has a very decent price to value, and will be supported for longer.

I snagged a Pixel 8A for around 200 on ebay.

Re: Keep Android Open

#598

Post by makeitdouble »

state_less wrote: post #356
TeMPOraL wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Answer: bank/financial apps, enterprise apps, government apps and copyrighted media (music, video, games, books, ...). Those are the players that demand excessive control over end-user devices, and thus the ultimate driver behind the problem we're discussing. It's not that a new mobile platform couldn't possibly succeed. It's an open platform that cannot, because aforementioned players don't want it, and without them…

Back in '99 Linux didn't run Excel/Word/Powerpoint or most games, but I ran it anyway. What others call showstoppers are for me inconveniences. I have a motorolla edge 2024 that I'll load whatever open source phone OS will work well enough to place calls and browse the web. I'll keep another phone for the rare times some corporate/government overlord requires it. Many folks who refuse to use smartphones, similarly ow…

> I'll keep another phone for the rare times some corporate/government overlord requires it.

Not having to do that is the whole point (especially as those are not rare to most of us).

This reminds me of a Woz interview in the early days of the iphone, and his solution to it not supporting multitask was also to run two phones.

Re: Keep Android Open

#599

Post by jayd16 »

kube-system wrote: post #577
jayd16 wrote: post #523

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can I get an example of a single one that can't be found on the web?

Netflix? Telegram's push 2FA? Any mobile wallet application? The vast majority of dating apps? Any of the app-only social networks? Basically all keyless entry applications?

All functionality found on the web.

Re: Keep Android Open

#600

Post by rjdj377dhabsn »

markus_zhang wrote: post #397

How about linuxonphone.org and just dump all your financial/auth related apps to an old Android phone? Actually, better, dumbphone.org and dump all financial/auth/chat apps to an old Android phone that costs some $200.

That's doable for now in some places. But in an increasing number of countries, payments for just about everything are done directly from an Android or iOS app, so you'd always have to carry around this locked-down phone as well your Linux phone.
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