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Using AI to negotiate a $195k hospital bill down to $33k

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Re: Using AI to negotiate a $195k hospital bill down to $33k

#351

Post by Projectiboga »

zzzeek wrote: post #267
egorfine wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

not sure why you're getting downmodded. People will say M4A ("medicare for all") polls at super high levels, and they're right, it does. But poll those same people telling them "would you favor that your employer-based healthcare would be rescinded and you would instead get healthcare from a new government controlled plan, where there would be no other options", which is the assumption M4A's viability is based on, an…

Every actuarial study about the switch projects total cost savings even during the first year. This scarsity of providers is artificial there haven't been enough medical student slots ever in America. American life expectancy isnt in the top 25 nations, while having the largest percapita GDP.

Re: Using AI to negotiate a $195k hospital bill down to $33k

#352

Post by egorfine »

willio58 wrote: post #338
egorfine wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

The United States is a democracy, but more specifically, a representative democracy. That means citizens don’t directly vote on most laws or policies—aside from certain state or local measures—but instead elect representatives to make those decisions on our behalf. The idea is that we trust them to act in our best interests. You can probably see where the problem comes in. Take, for example, a politician who campaign…

Ah, so Americans are okay with that system as well. Got it.

Re: Using AI to negotiate a $195k hospital bill down to $33k

#353

Post by atourgates »

BeetleB wrote: post #247

It's nice they succeeded, but a word of caution: Medicare is not a good standard - it's often lower than what it costs them to provide the care. If everyone paid Medicare rates, lots of providers would go out of business. The usual benchmark is the "usual and customary" charges for a procedure. You can look it up for a procedure for your area. You then go to the hospital and point out these charges. My guess is they'…

I broadly disagree.

Yes - Medicare is typically lower than private insurance plans, but if you can't deliver care for the reimbursement that Medicare offers as a health system/plan/office/provider, you're probably overcharging.

More than that, Medicare is the de facto starting place for most reimbursement negotiations between providers and payers. One of its benefits is that it's transparent and readily available. Blue Cross isn't gonna tell you what it's contracted to pay an individual provider (and that individual provider often won't know what they'll be reimbursed untill after they submit a bill) - but with Medicare the data's out there.

I know a good number of private clinics that'll offer cash pay discounts that effectively mirror Medicare or even slightly below Medicare, since you're saving them the trouble and expense of going through the medical billing process.

Re: Using AI to negotiate a $195k hospital bill down to $33k

#354

Post by Zambyte »

jimbokun wrote: post #237
Zambyte wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Software I write at work is not artistic expression yet is covered by copyright. This isn't a counter argument, just pointing out how absurd copyright is.

Your software is definitely artistic expression. You signed over the rights to those expressions to your employer. (IANAL)

My software is definitely not artistic expression. I signed over the rights to the software to my employer. These statements are not codependent in any way.

Re: Using AI to negotiate a $195k hospital bill down to $33k

#355

Post by tracker1 »

tptacek wrote: post #284
egorfine wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Scarcity is a fact of every country's health system and you'll quickly find stories with similar fact patterns with e.g. the NHS. There's not a lot to recommend the US system as implemented today, but the problem isn't "insurance-based health care"; lots of countries have insurance-based health care.

It's largely a side effect of a couple things... first the ACA (ObamaCare) limited the percentage of profit that insurance and medical providers can make... so they instead just grow the pie larger by inflating everything. Second is that they are allowed to have effectively vertical monopoly investments controlling multiple layers of healthcare as a whole from insurance, providers, pharma and pharmacies.

Trust busting and multiple supply lines really need to be established in order to have a chance at restoring normalcy. Which is all but impossible as Pharma alone is the single biggest spender of advertising alone, let alone policy influence over politicians.

Re: Using AI to negotiate a $195k hospital bill down to $33k

#356

Post by mothballed »

egorfine wrote: post #350
georgeecollins wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the reason is that people know it is a problem but ideologically they really disagree about what to do about it. The impasse creates an opportunity for profit driven actors to fight reforms. Also, democracies do dumb things sometimes. See Brexit. But also, sometimes people from other countries-- I am thinking parts of Europe-- underestimate how well paid people in the US often are. They compare the averages,…

> they really disagree about what to do about it What is there to disagree with? Are there any option other than introduction of universal healthcare?

There's already a soft alternative many people use, which is the deregulation option via geo-arbitrage, go to Mexico and get the same thing for 10 cents on the dollar.

Re: Using AI to negotiate a $195k hospital bill down to $33k

#357

Post by marcosdumay »

fsckboy wrote: post #263
pbhjpbhj wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A code is not an artistic expression and so can't be copyrightable. The layout of a book of codes, for sure, but the information in it... might be protectable with other IPR but not copyright. Does not stop people threatening you though. This is my opinion only, not legal advice, and does not relate to my employment.

> A code is not an artistic expression and so can't be copyrightable. that was changed https://www.bitlaw.com/copyright/database.html Databases are generally protected by copyright law as compilations. Under the Copyright Act, a compilation is defined as a "collection and assembling of preexisting materials or of data that are selected in such a way that the resulting work as a whole constitutes an original work of a…

That means the organization and selection of data is copyrightable, and only if they are creative. If you write your own tags for the codes, and makes a compilation of them all, none of that will cover your database.

Re: Using AI to negotiate a $195k hospital bill down to $33k

#358

Post by bboozzoo »

jobs_throwaway wrote: post #302
kwanbix wrote: post #51

Having lived in Europe 10 years (I am from south America), it is crazy that the rest of the world doesn't follow Europe's health coverage: everybody is covered, all the time, you can be covered either by public insurance (was my case) or private. There are no preconditions. Kids get covered for almost everything up until they are 18 or 21 (don't remember), drugs for adults is only 5 euro each. No matter the cost. And…

> US health care which is probably one of the worst in the world Not really. If you have money, the US system is one of the best. It just really, really sucks if you don't have money.

Isn't it universally true that if you're rich your life can be much easier? With enough wealth the actual health care system does not matter much. Neither does the country in which health care services are rendered. You just pay and get things done, and maybe even take some vacation while at it. However, given that not every one of us is rich, the point is to optimize the whole thing such that the little folk can still survive and get their health issues addressed.

Re: Using AI to negotiate a $195k hospital bill down to $33k

#359

Post by LeoPanthera »

ar_lan wrote: post #349
LeoPanthera wrote: post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's not a simple democracy, no (i.e. "enact a national-level vote for every issue and majority vote wins"). But it's worth remembering that, if it were, Trump would still have won. He won the popular vote. So, assuming that enough votes were legitimate, a majority of Americans actually do want the current health situation in the US, in fact arguably they want even less coverage.

We don't know if that's really accurate, because you're conveniently ignoring 2016. If Trump were never initially president, would he have ever become one? Maybe, maybe not. But 2024 surely would have looked very different.

This only serves to reenforce the fact that the US is not a functioning democracy, if the will of the voters is not reflected.

Re: Using AI to negotiate a $195k hospital bill down to $33k

#360

Post by nickff »

tracker1 wrote: post #335
egorfine wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Just Pharmaceuticals not even all medicine is literally over half of all advertising spend in the US. And that is just the tip of the iceberg and doesn't go into the incestuous and conflicting interest relationships between pharma, pharmacies, medical providers and insurance companies all inter-invested in each-other to simply grow the pie larger since ACA limited profit percentages. It's the single most powerful lob…

Pharmaceuticals are only a (high) single-digit percentage of medical spending in the USA, and the (likely) reason for the ads is the highly competitive nature of the market. Most of healthcare spending is on labor, specifically doctors and nurses, who are protected by highly effective trade and lobby organizations.
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