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FSF announces Librephone project

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Re: FSF announces Librephone project

#171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can’t tap my PC to buy a burrito at Chipotle.

You seem to be part of the problem. As long as people like you are happy to run spyware on their phones for the sake of convenience or a meager discount, companies will be empowered to make such software and devices a requirement.

Do you think the same for using credit cards in general or is using the phone somehow worse?

Re: FSF announces Librephone project

#172
post #3

> Practically, Librephone aims to close the last gaps between existing distributions of the Android operating system and software freedom. The FSF has hired experienced developer Rob Savoye (DejaGNU, Gnash, OpenStreetMap, and more) to lead the technical project. He is currently investigating the state of device firmware and binary blobs in other mobile phone freedom projects, prioritizing the free software work done…

The time is right, but I still don’t think this project can accomplish much because people are generally happy with their phones. That said, the phone market is huge. They could sell enough devices to fund future development which might be good enough even if it doesn’t slow down Apple or Google. At least then there will be a device for those of us who are not happy with the state of things.

> because people are generally happy with their phones.

Maybe thats exactly why it can succeed now. The phone tech has plateud to the point where a 5 year old phone performs almost identically as a new one and this is when people can afford to experiment and take more risks.

Also its much easier for free software to catch up now as most problems are already solved and/or easy to copy.

Re: FSF announces Librephone project

#173
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some banks require app confirmation for PC-initiated transactions, using play integrity requiring apps. Cause security, you know.

I think it's time to look for a new bank.

In my country we have a large religious community that eschews smartphones. Due to this no company or government agency requires a smartphone for service.

Re: FSF announces Librephone project

#175
Finally! It took the FSF long enough to catch up with the overwhelming usage of mobile devices, but it's better late than never.

I like that this project is trying to tackle something much more challenging that can't be done with just software: reverse engineering device firmware and binary blobs, the pieces of software that actually make hardware components interface with an OS. Understanding how this stuff functions is key to being able to write replacement software, so we may have less non-free software to deal with. I don't have any experience in trying to reverse engineer software, so the best I can do for now is cheer on from outside, unless I want to try my hands at this stuff later.

I also like that this project is not intending to produce an Android-based distro, but focusing more on reverse engineering. Although I read that the results are targeted at helping developers of Android-compatible OSes, the results can hopefully be used by non-Android [GNU/]Linux distros and perhaps other *nix stuff, like the BSD distros. The FSF (by way of developer Rob Savoye) recognizing that a project like this is not going to be quick, easy, or cheap, and is a long term effort is good, as that likely means this project isn't going to be easily abandoned just because of not being able to produce quick results.

I hope that this whole effort can eventually let us break free of the Apple-Google mobile device duopoly, as it sure is getting tiring for me to stick with one of these two companies for my mobile computing needs.

Re: FSF announces Librephone project

#176
post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The time is right, but I still don’t think this project can accomplish much because people are generally happy with their phones. That said, the phone market is huge. They could sell enough devices to fund future development which might be good enough even if it doesn’t slow down Apple or Google. At least then there will be a device for those of us who are not happy with the state of things.

> The time is right, but I still don’t think this project can accomplish much because people are generally happy with their phones. Is there survey data available on this? Anecdotally, everybody I know hates their phones. In fact, I think if you asked, "what's the biggest pain point in your life right now?" I think most people will point to their phones.

Maybe, but that pain point isn't something free software is going to fix. Obviously not everyone has the same problems with their phone, but largely I think they fall into a few categories: notification overload, apps designed to keep you scrolling for every last minute of the day, and dark patterns or other design choices aimed at separating users from as much of their money as possible.

Every single one of these is fixable on any modern phone. Stop using social media, take a hatchet to what apps can send you notifications and when, and be more mindful of what tricks are commonly deployed to steal your attention, time, and money.

But people can't even manage that. They don't even have to do anything, they just have to stop doing certain things, but they can't or won't. Those same people aren't going to go through the effort to switch, and even if they did they would end up re-creating the same thing that makes them miserable currently.

Re: FSF announces Librephone project

#178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you pay more money and also give up your privacy for what you could pay cash for. I don't think you're the target market for this phone.

I pay less money for my burrito than I would with cash, but the reason I use my phone is convenience, not cost. > I don't think you're the target market for this phone. My comment is downstream of the entertaining of a possibility of: > a significant user base that runs alternative operating systems ... which isn't going to happen if you ask your users to give up commonly used features. It will forever be a niche pro…

And there are still folks who don't use ad blockers.

Re: FSF announces Librephone project

#179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most importantly is to continue supporting web browser access and open web protocols. Then anyone with a web browser and device can use all the apps.

Exactly. A simple phone that runs a browser I can trust that's also capable of running web-based apps is all I need. I already avoid running apps on my iphone whenever possible. The phone I really want is as uncomplicated and open as possible and beholden to no corporate economic interests or privacy invasions. Now that I'm retired I'm looking for a project to immerse myself in. This sounds like just the ticket.

It depends on what definition of "uncomplicated" you'll assume, but that's pretty much how I perceive my Librem 5. It's fairly inspectable and relatively easy to understand as a computing device - no weird stuff like hundreds of disk partitions that you can't touch without risking bricking the phone like on Qualcomm devices, but a fairly regular GNU/Linux installation with well-defined boundaries on what's open and what's not - and it runs web apps pretty well. I have things like my bank, public transit planner, ride-hailing, webmail, RSS reader, Matrix client, package delivery status, even Facebook & Messenger for the handful of people that can still be only reached there - all "installed" as web apps using Epiphany (aka GNOME Web). Some of them required a bit of fiddling to discover which user-agent leads to a usable experience, but the results have been pretty good so far. In case I really need to run some Android app for some reason, I can boot Waydroid up and launch it there, though I use it very rarely. No corporate economic interests, no privacy invasions, no invasive notifications or ads, it simply works the way I want it to work. I just have to be careful with battery usage, but it's manageable :)
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