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Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

blog.miguelgrinberg.com

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Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#281

Post by Night_Thastus »

KK7NIL wrote: post #265
Night_Thastus wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try running software from 1995 on a brand new system and you'll find all sorts of fun reasons why it's more complicated than that.

Do you have any examples that aren't because of the OS (as in, not trying to run a 90's game on Windows 11) or specialized hardware (like an old Voodoo GPU or something)?

The whole point is that everything changes around software. Drivers, CPUs, GPUs, web browsers, OSs, common libraries, etc. Everything changes.

It doesn't matter if x86 is backwards compatible if everything else has changed.

No code can last 100 years in any environment with change. That's the point.

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#282

Post by cap11235 »

b3orn wrote: post #131
curiousityargh wrote: post #120

Kinda curious. Have you figured out why the code runs faster on a Mac?

It's two different computers with different CPUs, so different runtimes are expected and has nothing to do with the OS. > Framework laptop running Ubuntu Linux 24.04 (Intel Core i5 CPU) > Mac laptop running macOS Sequoia (M2 CPU)

Yes, and why? way to not address the question at all.

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#283

Post by denzil »

feoren wrote: post #82
amelius wrote: post #27

I hope it doesn't get stuck at 3.14, like TeX. https://www.reddit.com/r/RedditDayOf/comments/7we430/donald_...

You hope it doesn't ? > [Donald Knuth] firmly believes that having an unchanged system that will produce the same output now and in the future is more important than introducing new features This is such a breath of fresh air in a world where everything is considered obsolete after like 3 years. Our industry has a disease, an insatiable hunger for newness over completeness or correctness . There's no reason we can't…

Kinda related question, but is code really just a math? Is it possible to express things like user input, timings, inteerupts, error handling, etc. as math?

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#284

Post by api »

denzil wrote: post #283
feoren wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You hope it doesn't ? > [Donald Knuth] firmly believes that having an unchanged system that will produce the same output now and in the future is more important than introducing new features This is such a breath of fresh air in a world where everything is considered obsolete after like 3 years. Our industry has a disease, an insatiable hunger for newness over completeness or correctness . There's no reason we can't…

Kinda related question, but is code really just a math? Is it possible to express things like user input, timings, inteerupts, error handling, etc. as math?

Isn’t it possible to express anything as math? With sufficient effort that is.

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#285

Post by disentanglement »

kibwen wrote: post #185
feoren wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You hope it doesn't ? > [Donald Knuth] firmly believes that having an unchanged system that will produce the same output now and in the future is more important than introducing new features This is such a breath of fresh air in a world where everything is considered obsolete after like 3 years. Our industry has a disease, an insatiable hunger for newness over completeness or correctness . There's no reason we can't…

> There's no reason we can't be writing code that lasts 100 years. Code is just math. In theory, yes. In practice, no, because code is not just math, it's math written in a language with an implementation designed to target specific computing hardware, and computing hardware keeps changing. You could have the complete source code of software written 70 years ago, and at best you would need to write new code to emulat…

TeX is written in a literate programming style which is more akin to a math textbook than ordinary computer code, except with code blocks instead of equations. The actual programming language in the code blocks and the OS it runs on matters a lot less than in usual code where at best you get a few sparse comments. Avoiding bit rot in such a program is a very manageable task. In fact, iirc the code blocks which end up getting compiled and executed for TeX have been ported from Pascal to C at some point without introducing any new bugs.

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#286

Post by repsilat »

throwaway314155 wrote: post #49
username223 wrote: post #42

tl;dr: Two orders of magnitude slower than Rust, so 2-3 orders slower than native. Python on a 2 GHz processor runs as fast as C on a 2-20 MHz processor.

*for very specific benchmarks, not "on average"

For compute-heavy code "100x slower than C++" is a good rule of thumb in my experience in python 3.10.

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#287

Post by UltraSane »

Stratoscope wrote: post #168
wiseowise wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> flask Off-topic, but I absolutely loathe new Flask logo. Old one[0] has this vintage, crafty feel. And the new one[1] looks like it was made by a starving high schooler experimenting with WordArt. [0] - https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3c/Flask_lo... [1] - https://flask.palletsprojects.com/en/stable/_images/flask-na...

I hope they go Full Cracker Barrel on this: 1. Original logo has country charm and soul. 2. Replaced with a modern soulless logo. 3. Customer outrage! 4. Company (or open source project) comes to its senses and returns to old logo. https://media.nbcboston.com/2025/08/cracker-barrel-split.jpg (n.b. The Cracker Barrel Rebellion is sometimes associated with MAGA. I am very far from that, but I have to respect when peopl…

The Cracker Barrel "controversy" seems to have largely been fueled by bots.

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#288

Post by crote »

jcranmer wrote: post #275
KK7NIL wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a total red herring, x86 has over 30 years of backwards compatability and the same goes for the basic peripherals. The real reason for software churn isn't hardware churn, but hardware expansion. It's well known that software expands to use all available hardware resources (or even more, according to Wirth's law).

30 years ago, right before Windows 95 came out, Windows was a 16-bit OS and the modern versions of Windows no longer support 16-bit programs. PCIe came out only in 2003, and I don't know that PCIe slots can support PCI. SATA is also from 2003. Even USB originally came out in 1996, and the only pre-USB connector slot I have on my computer is a PS/2 port (which honestly surprises me). For monitor connections, VGA and D…

PCIe is mostly backwards compatible with PCI, and bridge chips used to be quite common. ISA to PCI is harder, but not unheard of.

"SATA" stands for "serial ATA", and has the same basic command set as the PATA from 1984 - bridge chips were widely used. And it all uses SCSI, which is also what USB Mass Storage Devices use. Or if you're feeling fancy, there's a whole SCSI-to-NVMe translation standard as well.

HDMI is fully compatible with single-land DVI-D, you can find passive adapters for a few bucks.

There's one port you forgot to mention: ethernet! A brand-new 10Gbps NIC will happily talk with an ancient 10Mbps NIC.

It might look different, but the pc world is filled with ancient technology remnants, and you can build some absolutely cursed adapter stacks. If anything, the limiting factor is Windows driver support.

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#289

Post by 201984 »

Iuz wrote: post #274

Is fold comment a option based on karma or something? I loved the most voted post here on how Miguel helped the guy but, it is unrelated and for the first time I guess I realized there is no fold so I can go to people actually talking about the article...

You got more karma than me, so you're probably just looking past it. It's the [-] button on the right end of the comment header, just to the right of the "next" button.

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#290

Post by BreakingProd »

wiseowise wrote: post #134
nadermx wrote: post #10

Tangential, but I practically owe my life to this guy. He wrote the flask mega tutorial in what I followed religiously to launch my first website. Then right before launch, in the most critical part of my entire application; piping a fragged file in flask. He answered my stackoverflow question, I put his fix live, and the site went viral. Here's the link for posterity's sake https://stackoverflow.com/a/34391304/41802…

> flask Off-topic, but I absolutely loathe new Flask logo. Old one[0] has this vintage, crafty feel. And the new one[1] looks like it was made by a starving high schooler experimenting with WordArt. [0] - https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3c/Flask_lo... [1] - https://flask.palletsprojects.com/en/stable/_images/flask-na...

I was unaware of the new logo… and I am just realizing for the first time after many many Flask apps… that the logo is not a chili pepper.
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