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How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

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Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#771

Post by JumpCrisscross »

swat535 wrote: post #688
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #626

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Israel lost the information/media war so damn badly that it may genuinely not recover from this Israel probably came out ahead if all they lost is prestige. They've neutered Iran and become the de facto regional security power. Their weapons and military have been validated, which makes than a desirable trading partner in an increasingly-militarising world. And they're turning into a gas exporter. Worst case, a gen…

> They've neutered Iran and become the de facto regional security power How did they "neuter" Iran? Iran responded quickly and managed to heavily damage TelAviv and is now rushing to accelerate rebuilding their nuclear capabilities. If anything, the previous operation was a disaster, it allowed to regime to entrench itself even further in IRAN and regime change that they were hoping for didn't happen. I'm sure both I…

> How did they "neuter" Iran? Iran responded quickly and managed to heavily damage TelAviv

Israel gained air superiority over Iran and successfully conducted military decapitation strikes. Iran sort of launched some half-assed rockets in Israel's direction.

The only damage Israel has suffered is to its intelligence faculties in Iran.

> the previous operation was a disaster, it allowed to regime to entrench itself even further in IRAN and regime change that they were hoping for didn't happen

It was a tactical failure and strategic success. Iran's proxies have been shown they're completely fucking on their own--Tehran can't defend itself.

As for regime change, Israel didn't prosecute its war in a way that suggests that was the aim. Separatism? Yes. Destabilisation? Sure. Incapacitation? Surely. But regime change? I really don't think so. Knocking out the regime would likely mean elements of the IRGC consolidating power. That isn't a win for Israel.

> I'm sure both Iran and Israel are gearing up for another round of heavy conflict later this year or early next year

Iran doesn't have the ranged capability.

> IRAN is still very much a threat to Israel

I haven't seen any credible, impartial analysis that suggests this is remotely the case.

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#772

Post by zimza »

bamboozled wrote: post #523
softwaredoug wrote: post #479

I've heard it said by eliminating all other avenues of Palestinian political expression, Netanyahu created modern Hamas. He undermined the two-state solution and Palestinian Authority. When you do this, you back people into a corner. There's no path to peacefully making progress on anything you care about. It also conveniently gives Netanyahu a boogeyman for his own political ends. You might argue the PA was corrupt,…

I feel like you could say Ukraine were backed into a corner, multiple times, they didn't resort to October 7 levels of horror either. In fact, there is not a single documented case where they have attacked civilians or civilian infrastructure. So while I'm not closed to the idea that Netanyahu is a bad man. I find it hard to rationalize the actions of the people who were "backed into a corner"?

The civilians are not living and partying on Ukrainian land, next to an open air prison.

Killing civilians is bad, killing soldiers invading your land is protected by international law.

October 7 is a tragic grain of sand in an desert of horrors the palestinian people suffered for nearly a century.

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#773

Post by JumpCrisscross »

master_crab wrote: post #723
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #641

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Cutting off that source of FX would literally half the economy overnight because cash would stop sloshing around internally from its main sources My point is this isn't a realistic threat for Israel. Its exports are highly desirable to too many parties. Technology. Weapons. Energy. There is too much money to be made, too much advantage to be had. Yes, if the war in Gaza continues for another decade, Israel will run…

China and India have problematic local Muslim populations. That doesn’t extend to supporting Israel. And they clearly don’t. China actively talks against it (because it builds global goodwill on the diplomatic stage) and India only plays lip service (they have more to gain from the Gulf than Israel).

> And they clearly don’t. China actively talks against it

They've both deepened trade ties with Israel throughout the war. India is literally selling Israel weapons [1].

[1] https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/war-on-gaza-indian-made-i...

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#774

Post by jameshilliard »

ImPostingOnHN wrote: post #761
jameshilliard wrote: post #742

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

It's always bizarre to hear this sort of doomsaying about what would befall israelis if they treated Palestinians as the equal humans they are: 'it's suicide to treat Palestinians as people'; 'innocent folks will be expelled from their land if we treat Palestinians as people'; "or worse, killed!' It's bizarre because all the horrible prophecies have already come true, or are coming true, only with the roles reversed:…

The last time Palestinians voted they quite literally elected Hamas terrorists[0], you're making it out as if making Jews a minority and Palestinians a majority in Israel wouldn't represent an existential threat to the Jewish population. There are zero Jews living under Palestinian rule(i.e Gaza and the West Bank Areas A/B), why do you think it would be any different if they were given majority voting rights in Israel?

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Palestinian_legislative_e...

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#775

Post by JumpCrisscross »

pyuser583 wrote: post #752
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #641

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Cutting off that source of FX would literally half the economy overnight because cash would stop sloshing around internally from its main sources My point is this isn't a realistic threat for Israel. Its exports are highly desirable to too many parties. Technology. Weapons. Energy. There is too much money to be made, too much advantage to be had. Yes, if the war in Gaza continues for another decade, Israel will run…

Historically Israel has been very paranoid about accepting American support. During the Cold War they played both sides: socialist but democratic. Even now they can get the Chinese on the line in a minutes notice. I’m pretty sure the Chinese are running one of their ports.

> Even now they can get the Chinese on the line in a minutes notice. I’m pretty sure the Chinese are running one of their ports

China has actually been more arms length in this conflict, possibly due to its relations with Iran, possibly because it wants Israel to fully commit east. (Possibly because they have a moral position on occupation and genocide, though unlikely, it's not like they're handing back Tibet and Xinxiang.)

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#776

Post by andrewcamel »

A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #591

Israel's response to Oct 7th has been a major blackpill. Their strategy was, I think, as bad as it could possibly be. In fact, it really seemed, and still seems, like no strategy at all -- they lashed out wildly and extremely destructively, without a clear picture of what the post-war Gaza Strip will look like. Hamas successfully baited Israel into a disproportionate response that killed tens of thousands, if not hun…

What response would you suggest for Israel?

My understanding is their civilian vs combatant ratio is lower than comparable urban conflicts. So it’s hard to respond “softer”.

Population adjusted, 10/7 was 10x+ worse than 9/11. Challenging to expect zero response.

So what else is there?

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#777

Post by Stevvo »

hereme888 wrote: post #657

[flagged]

Even if Israel actually were trying to recover the hostages, this wouldn't make sense. Over 20,000 dead Palestinian children and blocking aid does not recover any hostages. On the contrary, it only fuels the terror ideology ensuring Hamas is never eradicated. Israel is responsible for its own actions. It is not Hamas who is using starvation as a weapon of war, it is Israel.

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#778

Post by tomhow »

FilosofumRex wrote: post #751

[flagged]

Could you please stop posting ideological flamebait? Looking at your history, most of your comments seem related to politics/ideology, including multiple comments referencing stereotypes, like this one [1]. It's not what this site is for, and destroys what it is for. We have to ban accounts that continue to do this after being warned.

If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45230809

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#779

Post by ruszki »

pbreit wrote: post #519
Animats wrote: post #115

“Israel has built the most efficient starvation machine you can imagine.” There's political opposition to this within Israel. Here's what happened to an elected member of the Knesset who spoke out against the cruelty in Gaza.[1] He was forcibly removed from the podium of the Knesset. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UzDxV7jnAos

[flagged]

Is there any direct source for the questionability which does not come from Israel, or from entities backed by Israel? Because nowadays, all of these “sources” which I’ve seen to be shared were clearly lying propaganda, like “they lied about what the link said” obvious lies, or shared links which were said by Israel basically. The funniest was the account whose only purpose was to show that Palestine was rich in reality, and tried to show that shops are still full with stuffs there, while clearly tried to disguise from where or when the information came. And it does only that, nothing else.

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#780

Post by [deleted] »

swat535 wrote: post #688
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #626

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Israel lost the information/media war so damn badly that it may genuinely not recover from this Israel probably came out ahead if all they lost is prestige. They've neutered Iran and become the de facto regional security power. Their weapons and military have been validated, which makes than a desirable trading partner in an increasingly-militarising world. And they're turning into a gas exporter. Worst case, a gen…

> They've neutered Iran and become the de facto regional security power How did they "neuter" Iran? Iran responded quickly and managed to heavily damage TelAviv and is now rushing to accelerate rebuilding their nuclear capabilities. If anything, the previous operation was a disaster, it allowed to regime to entrench itself even further in IRAN and regime change that they were hoping for didn't happen. I'm sure both I…

[deleted]
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