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UK Petition: Do not introduce Digital ID cards

petition.parliament.uk

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Re: UK Petition: Do not introduce Digital ID cards

#91

Post by teamonkey »

oncallthrow wrote: post #79
teamonkey wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It is a criminal offense in the UK to use insulting words in public, or to send any message online that anyone could find insulting or offensive (whether any one does or not is irreverent). This is categorically untrue.

The latter part at least is true. Sending "grossly offensive" messages is illegal under the Malicious Communications Act 1988 and the Communications Act 2003, specifically Section 127: > a person is guilty of an offence if he— > (a)sends by means of a public electronic communications network a message or other matter that is grossly offensive or of an indecent, obscene or menacing character; or > (b)causes any such m…

[flagged]

Re: UK Petition: Do not introduce Digital ID cards

#92

Post by surfingdino »

dijit wrote: post #3

As well as the Estonia eID system works (aside from that time it got hacked[0] and that other time they leaked all the photos[1]) and how well a digital (non-government) system works in Scandinavia… I have to say… As a Dual British/Swedish Citizen, I really do not trust the UK government. They have proven over and over and over, that at every opportunity presented they will increase their own authority. I don’t belie…

Estonia (and now Ukraine) have worked on being able to do a "backup" of the country and a "restore" elsewhere if needed. (I am oversimplifying, but contingency plans have been part of the overall design that eID is a part of.) The UK doesn't have such designs and contingencies in place. The private sector is no better, every year there are major security breaches. It is premature to stick Digital ID onto a rickety network of badly secured databases.

Re: UK Petition: Do not introduce Digital ID cards

#93

Post by Spivak »

mytailorisrich wrote: post #26
AJRF wrote: post #21

The labour government can not be challenged in any serious way until the next election in 4 years. Petitions don't really do anything, they will just say "no" to what the people ask for and move on with their agenda. It is disheartening to see this country follow the same path the US took, it seems as our politics become more polarised, the team sports aspect means we start seeing parties push through agendas while p…

Regarding tackling illegal immigration the issue is that there are already ample and sufficients checks mandated by law so this would not change anything. Indeed the main issue is that there are dodgy employers and landlords who simply flunk the law and would oviously continue to do so and ignore Digital IDs all the same. Digital IDs would also be de facto mandatory for the majority of adult residents based on what t…

> Indeed the main issue is that there are dodgy employers and landlords who simply flunk the law

I'm surprised that this is your framing, I don't think I would hesitate to offer a willing tenant or otherwise good employee a job because of their legal status. Mostly just on principle, it's not my job to be an arm of the state and I resent being deputized. They're physically here in my town, better they have somewhere to live and a means of supporting themselves rather than being homeless. If the state wants to find and deport them they can do it themselves on their own time.

Re: UK Petition: Do not introduce Digital ID cards

#94

Post by crimsoneer »

dmazin wrote: post #24

The thing that frustrates me the most about digital ID cards is not themselves on merit but rather modern Labour's political abilities. Like, the UK economy is stagnant, there is a cost-of-living crisis, and Labour needs to present the public with an alternative to Farage. And the answer is... digital ID cards?

If you want to improve the capacity of the state to deliver services and improve the lives of citizens, being able to easily tell who is who across a range of government departments is a pretty good place to start.

Re: UK Petition: Do not introduce Digital ID cards

#95

Post by suyash »

uyzstvqs wrote: post #57

We need to clearly define some stuff around Digital ID, since people seem to be using the term for distinctly different things. There's (1) eGovernment platforms, where you can handle government-related business online using a login. There's (2) Digital ID cards, where you can use your phone in place of a physical ID or drivers license in real life. And then there's (3) full EU-proposed-style Digital ID, where govern…

There are already systems to check immigration status "Right to Work" in the UK that employer can use to check any immigratants current status.

Re: UK Petition: Do not introduce Digital ID cards

#96

Post by dalke »

dijit wrote: post #59
dalke wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Swedish non-government system (BankID) doesn't work well for me. My Swedish identity must not be dependent on the permission of a US company nor the US government, while BankID requires both. So far my BankID boycott is over a year old, and my resolve grows as I read more of the news.

Ask your bank for a pin machine, you can get a chip and pin machine to solve BankID challenges. The machine itself is likely manufactured in China, but it’s of no consequence. You wouldn’t be able to communicate with me if you didn’t use chinese products at all.

You mean Bank-id på kort? https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bank-id#Bank-id_på_kort says it only supports MS Windows and MacOS, not Linux.

Fundamentally though, that doesn't change the fact that the US can order a Swedish bank to either freeze access to a customer or the bank can no longer do business in the US.

Re: UK Petition: Do not introduce Digital ID cards

#98

Post by gslepak »

skeletal88 wrote: post #80
dijit wrote: post #3

As well as the Estonia eID system works (aside from that time it got hacked[0] and that other time they leaked all the photos[1]) and how well a digital (non-government) system works in Scandinavia… I have to say… As a Dual British/Swedish Citizen, I really do not trust the UK government. They have proven over and over and over, that at every opportunity presented they will increase their own authority. I don’t belie…

Our system in Estonia works well. I don't get the resistance to a digital/national id in other countries. To us it is quite bizarre. Some have explained it with a lack of trust between citizens and the country. But without such digital id it is impossible to have such digital government services as we have here. The government services need to verify and autheticate the citizen, so they only access their own data and…

> I don't get the resistance to a digital/national id in other countries. To us it is quite bizarre.

It depends on the country and its relationship with the people. If the people trust that their government represents the people's interests, there is little push-back. In countries where citizens have reason to believe their government is hijacked by interests that do not have their best interests at heart, then every move is viewed with suspicion.

In this case people are tying Digital ID to CBDCs and social credit systems, which is a reasonable thing to do, given this is exactly how China uses them to enforce 15-minute cities with checkpoints between them. All citizens conversations are tracked, their movements are restricted as well [1], and their ability to purchase goods & services are tightly regulated based on their behavior via the social credit system. This is the world that people who are pushing back against this are trying to avoid.

[1] https://x.com/songpinganq/status/1972382547427590401

Re: UK Petition: Do not introduce Digital ID cards

#100

Post by raesene9 »

dijit wrote: post #88
raesene9 wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The online safety act is a terrible piece of legislation, along with a variety of other ones promoted as being for "child safety" but having serious external consequences. But they implemented that act, without needing a digital ID. I don't think they need a digital ID to push authoritarian policies. And I think a digital ID has possible benefits for people who can't easily fit in to current setups, thus my point abo…

The Digital ID will make it so that there’s no excuse for not connecting your identity to everything you do.

The conservatives didnt need digital id to make id a requirement for voting, labour didnt need digital id to introduce the online safety act. Im not convinced that lack of digital id will deter authoritarian tendencies in uk govs…
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