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Massive Attack turns concert into facial recognition surveillance experiment

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Re: Massive Attack turns concert into facial recognition surveillance experiment

#141

Post by sschueller »

insickness wrote: post #52
jkestner wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that people were uncomfortable with simply having their pictures taken and shown without their knowledge gives lie to the idea that "You're in a public place—of course you have no right to privacy." It's great to be given the chance to face your principles.

Public photography is not a crime, nor should it be. However, that doesn't mean your likeness can be used for just any purpose.

In Switzerland, you have the right to privacy including in public.

This means you can not make a photo/video of a person in public without their consent if they are the focus of your image. They also have the right to revoke consent anytime in the future.

The only exception is at large gatherings like for example the Street Parade where the expectation of privacy can not be expected especially since the event is televised.

This is also why you can not put cameras on your home that film public streets etc. They need to be blocked off or facing the other way.

Re: Massive Attack turns concert into facial recognition surveillance experiment

#142

Post by tjpnz »

Neil44 wrote: post #140
tjpnz wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That theory is based on art springing up in locations where Massive Attack are playing. It's a bit odd because by that logic it could also be any of the dozens of people needed on tour.

Didn't Goldie accidentally refer to Banksy as 'Rob' in an interview once too.

Different Rob.

Re: Massive Attack turns concert into facial recognition surveillance experiment

#143

Post by ahoka »

thw_9a83c wrote: post #11

> The band deployed live facial recognition technology that captured and analyzed attendees during their recent performance. I think more drama has been created around this than is necessary. Based on the video, the real-time projected visitor's faces were not analyzed. They were simply shown with a random description flag attached, such as "energetic," "compassionate," "inspiring," "fitness influencer," or "cloud wa…

Their pictures were used in a commercial, for-profit setting without consent.

Re: Massive Attack turns concert into facial recognition surveillance experiment

#144

Post by anal_reactor »

sschueller wrote: post #141
insickness wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Public photography is not a crime, nor should it be. However, that doesn't mean your likeness can be used for just any purpose.

In Switzerland, you have the right to privacy including in public. This means you can not make a photo/video of a person in public without their consent if they are the focus of your image. They also have the right to revoke consent anytime in the future. The only exception is at large gatherings like for example the Street Parade where the expectation of privacy can not be expected especially since the event is tele…

Eh. These laws exist in DACH area but the result is that when someone's committing a crime, you can't film them in order to create evidence, because that would breach their right to privacy. Someone stole shit from your front porch? Someone broke into your car? Someone pulled an insurance scam on you? Well, tough luck, it's illegal for you to provide film evidence.

In more sensible countries the law says that it's legal to film, but it's not legal to publish videos and photos of people without their consent.

Re: Massive Attack turns concert into facial recognition surveillance experiment

#145

Post by cindyllm »

anal_reactor wrote: post #144
sschueller wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Switzerland, you have the right to privacy including in public. This means you can not make a photo/video of a person in public without their consent if they are the focus of your image. They also have the right to revoke consent anytime in the future. The only exception is at large gatherings like for example the Street Parade where the expectation of privacy can not be expected especially since the event is tele…

Eh. These laws exist in DACH area but the result is that when someone's committing a crime, you can't film them in order to create evidence, because that would breach their right to privacy. Someone stole shit from your front porch? Someone broke into your car? Someone pulled an insurance scam on you? Well, tough luck, it's illegal for you to provide film evidence. In more sensible countries the law says that it's le…

[dead]

Re: Massive Attack turns concert into facial recognition surveillance experiment

#146

Post by mpalmer »

ahoka wrote: post #143
thw_9a83c wrote: post #11

> The band deployed live facial recognition technology that captured and analyzed attendees during their recent performance. I think more drama has been created around this than is necessary. Based on the video, the real-time projected visitor's faces were not analyzed. They were simply shown with a random description flag attached, such as "energetic," "compassionate," "inspiring," "fitness influencer," or "cloud wa…

Their pictures were used in a commercial, for-profit setting without consent.

Being "used in a commercial, for-profit setting" is not a thing.

Their images were not being sold, nor were they being used to promote the concert. Plus, nearly everyone who goes to a concert these days agrees that their image will be captured and possibly used in future promotional material.

Re: Massive Attack turns concert into facial recognition surveillance experiment

#147

Post by js8 »

tonymet wrote: post #64

Think about the most notorious authoritarian regimes. Third Reich, GDR , USSR, Mao's China. They had relatively weak surveillance capacity. Secret police had to personally spy on the target and manually install bugs/taps. Technology was primitive and error prone. Most casual conversations were less vulnerable to spying. Rural people were relatively safe. Private conversations could be easily held in secret (e.g. walk…

Let me give an optmistic counterpoint. We should go back to Gramsci, who observed that the regime holds itself to power mostly by ideological hegemony. If everyone is being wiretapped, it's difficult to construct and maintain ideology that would justify that.

We can imagine something like 1984, where it was only the party (middle) class monitored for thinking. But proletariat (low) class was free to think whatever - because they knew system was bad; they weren't required to pretend.

I guess my point is, the totalitarian system doesn't need widespread surveillance. But it needs believable ideology, which enough people from low and middle class believes to keep the communication barrier between these groups sufficiently closed.

Is the neoliberalism such ideology? Is it something that can offer enough positives to sustain/counterpoint negatives of widespread surveillance? I doubt it.

We can look at recent examples where UK and US tried to control the narrative and failed - Palestine Action, ICE arrests, troop deployments in cities, Tiktok ban.. Despite surveillance, people are not buying the ideology.

Re: Massive Attack turns concert into facial recognition surveillance experiment

#148

Post by elric »

insickness wrote: post #52
jkestner wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that people were uncomfortable with simply having their pictures taken and shown without their knowledge gives lie to the idea that "You're in a public place—of course you have no right to privacy." It's great to be given the chance to face your principles.

Public photography is not a crime, nor should it be. However, that doesn't mean your likeness can be used for just any purpose.

This is an erroneous blanket statement. Photographing people in public is illegal in plenty of places, depending on what exactly you're doing. Taking a picture of a big crowd is usually fine. Singling out individuals sometimes isn't.

IIRC some countries recently started experimenting with automagically granting copyright to people for their own likeness, I think it was aimed at AI generates fakes, but it's probably more widely applicable.

Anyway, don't be a dick, don't take pictures of people without their consent.

Re: Massive Attack turns concert into facial recognition surveillance experiment

#149

Post by ehnto »

piva00 wrote: post #116
jolmg wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Public photography is not a crime, nor should it be. IDK about shouldn't. Public photography not being a crime comes from a time where one could still be generally expected to remain anonymous despite being photographed. Just like how you can be seen by strangers in the street while walking and still remain anonymous. Yet stalking is a crime, and facial recognition seems to be the digital equivalent. Facial recogni…

It shouldn't, you wouldn't be able to photograph candid moments in public of your own family/group of friends if anyone's else face showed up in the picture, that's not a world I want to live in. It would also completely kill any form of street photography, even if you don't appreciate the art it would kill documenting times and places for posterity, for what benefit exactly?

Strengthening of your right to privacy against an entirely new paradigm of state and individual surveillance. It is a new world.

I actually don't find it hard to sacrifice the recreational photography of strangers, but I do have a hard time balancing it with the need to photograph crime and government entities overstepping their authorities.

I don't have a good answer for it all.

Re: Massive Attack turns concert into facial recognition surveillance experiment

#150

Post by m_st »

Microsoft made something similar, years ago, at the presentation of their azure cognitive services. A camera randomly picked a live face from the audience, passed it through azure cognitive services and displayed the mood of the person in a video overlay.
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