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US High school students' scores fall in reading and math

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Re: US High school students' scores fall in reading and math

#881

Post by nervousvarun »

bdcravens wrote: post #868
ainiriand wrote: post #861

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have not read that subtext, maybe is your own unconscious bias...

The commenter suggested the old school was filled with bad kids and bad parents, and by definition, this would include the commenter and their kids. Unless they are suggesting they weren't the bad ones, and were somehow unfairly placed with the riff raff. If that's the case, some analysis of why that is seems in order.

From the commenter: "The good school has smarter kids with better parents. The bad school had dull kids with bad parents. The kids at the new school do their homework, read, play outside. The kids at the old school skipped homework, played call of duty, and could hardly read."

That appears to be their observation of the two schools they had direct experience with. What else are you asking they provide here in terms of analysis? Maybe average student test scores? Likely available as it appears they are talking about public schools here. If the new school has significantly better scores would that satisfy your analysis requirement? If the test scores within their household subsequently follow this trend would that be sufficient analysis? In general active/concerned parents are going to try to get their kids the best education available right?

Also can you elaborate on where you got the "unfairly placed" part? All that was actually said was they moved from one school district to another. People buy homes for school districts all the time...there's a section dedicated to school rankings on Zillow for a reason.

Re: US High school students' scores fall in reading and math

#882

Post by etempleton »

hamdingers wrote: post #765
etempleton wrote: post #654

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the US there are a few obvious things, but everyone acts as if we are powerless to solve them: 1. Cell phones in classrooms. I don’t know how or why they were ever allowed. They should have to be in a backpack or in a locker and off during class. 2. Not removing students with bad behavior from classrooms and schools. The current thinking on how to handle a student who is seriously misbehaving and potentially viole…

> 4. Too many parents aren’t parenting You attribute this to increased laziness, and that might contribute, but there are other factors at play. For one, it takes significantly more hours of work from both parents just to provide basic food & shelter than it did a few decades ago. Calling parents who work more hours than any previous generation in history "lazy" is itself lazy and misses the point.

Did not say “lazy” as you misquote, just that it isn’t happening.

Re: US High school students' scores fall in reading and math

#883

Post by kulahan »

constantcrying wrote: post #875
jmpman wrote: post #693

My son is taking a woodworking class in high school. First week, he came home and I asked him what he was doing in his woodworking class… “Disassembling the library bookcases”. “Why???” “Because they’re getting rid of the library”. Apparently the school board decided to save money by cutting the librarian, and then decided to just move the books out of the school library and into the “nearby” public library. In reali…

Good riddance. Libraries are totally pointless and a waste of money. Almost every book that is available at all can be accessed within seconds on any modern digital device. You will learn how extremely valuable that is when you actually are doing research. Students should be taught how to actually do research, not how to waste time looking things up in some small buildings which doesn't have the resources they need.

Have you not been in a library in like 50 years? It’s a hell of a lot more than a “small building which doesn’t have the resources they need”.

Re: US High school students' scores fall in reading and math

#884

Post by tracker1 »

Aurornis wrote: post #417
JKCalhoun wrote: post #357

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Democrats that will dumb down classes to make sure even the worst performing student will pass News to me.

Unfortunately it’s a real thing among leftists (not necessarily Democrats in general). The belief is that any advanced classes increase the achievement gap. People who subscribe to this also believe that advanced placement testing is discrimination and must be eliminated. They want equity of outcome, so reducing the curriculum to a single class at a single level that everyone the same age takes is their preference. I…

The funny, and somewhat ironic thing is from my own understanding of Communist nations is they don't even try to do this... USSR put in a fair amount of effort to promote excellence and achievement for students into more specialized programs earlier than later. With an overall increased divide between the best and worst performing. I find it hard to fathom that there are those in the US that work so hard to hold back advancement from those most capable.

Re: US High school students' scores fall in reading and math

#885

Post by gilfoy »

Scubabear68 wrote: post #103
lucideng wrote: post #33

The majority of the public school system has devolved into day-care, not education. Most parents just watch TV, stare at their phones and don't want to be bothered by anything that requires effort. A major societal shift needs to happen for this to be reversed. It's many factors... the parents, the food system, various inequalities, social media, technology, healthcare... the solution is multi-pronged. But if I had t…

I live in the US in New Jersey, and here a big problem was the State flooded school districts with money during Covid with no material oversight of its spending. The end result was huge increases in spending. But not on education. The money was spent on more MacBooks, more iPads, more buildings, more smart TVs, more consultants, more School Bullshit System as a Service, more scoreboards, more $50,000 signs in front o…

> The money was spent on more MacBooks, more iPads, more buildings, more smart TVs, more consultants, more School Bullshit System as a Service, more scoreboards, more $50,000 signs in front of schools.

> “social justice”

So they spend all their effort on social justice, but spend none of their money on it? You should move to the South, you can pick a charter/magnate/whatever school with no special education and no busses. Keeps out the pesky blacks and retarded.

Somewhat of a pain though since my son has autism and services are pretty shit compared to where I lived in NJ

Re: US High school students' scores fall in reading and math

#886

Post by cyberax »

aeternum wrote: post #189
estimator7292 wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The core problem is actually twofold: 1. We pay teachers like shit and treat them even worse. Even if you wanted to do a good job as a teacher, it's fundamentally impossible because: 2. Our schools are structured and run by busybodies that have absolutely no business being within 100 yards of a school. Curricula is set by politics and ideology, not established science. We have book bans and helicopter parents suing t…

> systematic disassembling of our education system by the federal government So you support shutting down the federal Dept. of Education? Or is the answer more centralized control of education?

I fully support shutting down the DoE and starting from scratch. It has failed.

Instead, institute a voucher system and allow parents to literally shop around for the best school. With obvious allowances for children with special needs, rural areas, etc.

Education needs competition. Badly.

Re: US High school students' scores fall in reading and math

#887

Post by [deleted] »

OhMeadhbh wrote: post #755
jmpman wrote: post #693

My son is taking a woodworking class in high school. First week, he came home and I asked him what he was doing in his woodworking class… “Disassembling the library bookcases”. “Why???” “Because they’re getting rid of the library”. Apparently the school board decided to save money by cutting the librarian, and then decided to just move the books out of the school library and into the “nearby” public library. In reali…

[flagged]

[deleted]

Re: US High school students' scores fall in reading and math

#888

Post by cyberax »

abenga wrote: post #473
cyberax wrote: post #454

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OK, here's a question. Should every sportball team in the US be prohibited from being selective? Everyone, regardless of their capability, should be able to play on the same field. Including paraplegics because it's not their fault. It's a lofty ideal, don't you think?

If playing sports was essential to living to everyone across the board, yeah, they would be prohibited from being selective.

Trans people in school/collegiate sports resulted in a lost US election for the Democrats (sports scholarships are a thing). That's how important it is.

And no, I don't think that the advanced education is essential. General education is, but not advanced courses. And of course, everyone absolutely deserves a fair _chance_ to get the best possible education.

Re: US High school students' scores fall in reading and math

#889

Post by constantcrying »

kulahan wrote: post #883
constantcrying wrote: post #875

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good riddance. Libraries are totally pointless and a waste of money. Almost every book that is available at all can be accessed within seconds on any modern digital device. You will learn how extremely valuable that is when you actually are doing research. Students should be taught how to actually do research, not how to waste time looking things up in some small buildings which doesn't have the resources they need.

Have you not been in a library in like 50 years? It’s a hell of a lot more than a “small building which doesn’t have the resources they need”.

Without a doubt in my entire academic life the books have been the least useful thing libraries contained. Getting rid of them provides space for the good and productive things people do in a library.

It is important that students have quiet space to study. But libraries as book storages have very little utility and seem very hard to justify.

Re: US High school students' scores fall in reading and math

#890

Post by cyberax »

nobody9999 wrote: post #496
cyberax wrote: post #472

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are _plenty_ of areas in physics where investment is paying off. Condensed matter physics, optics, material research and so on. We mostly question the fundamental subatomic particle physics that is not producing any returns on the investment. E.g. the galvanic effect was discovered in 1780, and there were long-distance telegraph lines by 1845 - so 65 years. The last major theoretical advance in particle physics…

There's at least one actual physicist who will provide you with appropriate counterpoint. Here they are. And you're welcome. a physicist responds: physics has done very little for like 70 years [0] [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_o4k0eLoMI

She's confirming my point. There are plenty of advances in physics outside of the foundational subatomic physics.

And literally nothing in subatomic physics. The theories from 1960-s made predictions that were later confirmed: Higgs boson, neutrino oscillations, etc.

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