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The share of Americans having regular sex keeps dropping

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Re: The share of Americans having regular sex keeps dropping

#31

Post by sonictomb »

In micro economics, when a substitute reduces in cost and increases in quality, we see a substitution effect [0] (amusingly, coined by economist Eugen Slutsky), i.e. people switch away from the relatively expensive good and into its lower cost substitute.

The primary substitute for physical sex is DIY with porn. Over the past 30 years porn has become orders of magnitudes cheaper (pre internet, it was ~$9 to see ~5 humans nude a la playboy magazine, and involved a trip to the shops; now it's approximately free and instant). Porn simultaneously increased orders of magnitude in quality and variety.

If you apply the same thinking to any other two substitute products (i.e. one gets 1000x cheaper whilst improving in quality and variety, whilst the original stays approximately the same), we could expect the exact same results, i.e. switching from one to the other.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Substitution_effect

Re: The share of Americans having regular sex keeps dropping

#32

Post by fruitworks »

mewpmewp2 wrote: post #18
d4mi3n wrote: post #9

Is this really all that surprising? We have a ton of things ongoing now that we either know or suspect are big contributors to this: - the whole male loneliness epidemic - a longstanding loss of community and social organizations around the country - a pretty terrible job market for many Americans - plenty of things to be stressed or worried about. Geopolitical instability. Erosion of individual rights. The complete…

On the other hand historically there's been circumstances far worse than we are having now in terms of war, famine, diseases, living standards and it didn't stop people from reproducing at all. I really doubt it's that. I think it's something else.

war, disease and famine remove the excess men and makes society less interconnected.

Technology makes society more interconnected and puts men in competition with a greater number of their peers.

My observation from comparing different societies is that the amount of sex increases as men have greater leverage over women, and vice-versa.

Re: The share of Americans having regular sex keeps dropping

#34

Post by AnimalMuppet »

revx wrote: post #5

The article mostly blames pornography and digital addiction, but I think those are symptoms of a larger problem, which is lack of belonging and community. If life sucks, you have few friends you can afford the time or money to see, and you work to make other people rich until you are exhausted, when do you have time and energy to maintain a relationship? If you feel like the world is on fire, it's hard to get in the…

Hmm. Off topic, but I wonder if the reason for your second paragraph isn't your first paragraph. Sex and alcohol both are often escapes, and if you don't have time and energy for one, why would you have time and energy (and money) for the other?

Back on topic: You mention "people who aren't putting in any emotional labor to learning and growing as a person". But, from your first paragraph, who's got time and energy for that?

My own guess at an additional factor: Women's equality has made women who didn't need to depend on a man. As a result, they got a lot choosier about what downsides, flaws, and baggage they were willing to put up with.

Re: The share of Americans having regular sex keeps dropping

#35

Post by add-sub-mul-div »

f-securus wrote: post #17
ancillary wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Americans: why isn't anyone having sex anymore?? Also Americans: Abstinence only! You'll get pregnant! No abortions! STDs will kill you! Men deserve sex! We're not going to teach you how your body works! None of that is new in America. If anything, I'd expect that these forces were stronger 20-30 years ago, when sexual activity rates were higher.

Roe V Wade reversal and the extent they rolled back women’s rights has certainly changed the atmosphere.

True. The decline has been in effect for a while, but as for recent chages losing reproductive freedom can't be helping, nor AI and legal weed as two new ways for people to opiate themselves.

Re: The share of Americans having regular sex keeps dropping

#36

Post by hiatus »

ryoshu wrote: post #27
ancillary wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Americans: why isn't anyone having sex anymore?? Also Americans: Abstinence only! You'll get pregnant! No abortions! STDs will kill you! Men deserve sex! We're not going to teach you how your body works! None of that is new in America. If anything, I'd expect that these forces were stronger 20-30 years ago, when sexual activity rates were higher.

Social media and phones with cameras has made a lot of people risk adverse. When a video can hit Twitter or TikTok or Reddit about something that can ruin your life why risk it?

There are people running around poisoning produce and posting it online—I don't think camera shyness is an element of it.

Re: The share of Americans having regular sex keeps dropping

#37

Post by d4mi3n »

amelius wrote: post #13
d4mi3n wrote: post #9

Is this really all that surprising? We have a ton of things ongoing now that we either know or suspect are big contributors to this: - the whole male loneliness epidemic - a longstanding loss of community and social organizations around the country - a pretty terrible job market for many Americans - plenty of things to be stressed or worried about. Geopolitical instability. Erosion of individual rights. The complete…

Feminism maybe? (yes controversial, more science needed)

Doubt it, but I wouldn’t be surprised if the erosion of woman’s rights is contributing. There are places in the US today where you will die by a pregnancy gone wrong because doctors are terrified of losing their licenses and livelihoods if a court rules (after the fact) that the procedure wasn’t necessary.

Where women are forced to carry to term after rape.

Where seeking medical care in another state for either scenario will result in prosecution.

These are real, serious concerns for many woman that will have a cooling effect on their willingness to have intimate relationships.

Re: The share of Americans having regular sex keeps dropping

#38

Post by toomuchtodo »

ksenzee wrote: post #2

To quote a relative of mine, when asked if he and his wife were going to have a third child: “No, no. We found out what causes that. We don’t do that anymore.”

My vasectomy was 15 min in and out at no cost to me (ten US states require insurance cover with no cost sharing as of this comment), and I have all the sex I can get (respectfully asking anyone who might be interested) with no offspring risk. Perhaps this is not a well known option?

Re: The share of Americans having regular sex keeps dropping

#39

Post by jayceedenton »

It's not really surprising. Hetero sexual desire has been framed negatively for well over a decade, as at best exploitative and at worst misogynistic and perverted. Men told that if you want sex you're part of society's biggest problem, and women told that if you give in to a man's sordid desires you are being taken advantage of and subjugated. All we ever talk about is the dreaded 'power imbalance'.

We've removed sex from normal life as far as possible. Films can be full of violence but any hint of titillation is verboten now. Any reference to sex in normal walks of life is seen as harassment, chauvinistic or pandering to the male gaze. Our culture is influenced by global social and religious conservatism in the quest to sell media to as many markets as possible. Our own new conservatism (the so-called left wing) is just as bad.

On top of that we have the culmination of a few decades of obsessive education about STDs and sex as a dangerous act that can ruin lives. A far cry from 'The Joy of Sex' as a cultural phenomenon.

We're letting prudes and those with deep psychological issues around sex call the shots. Millennials and Gen Z may be a lost cause, but let's hope that Gen A can rewrite the rules.

Re: The share of Americans having regular sex keeps dropping

#40

Post by alehlopeh »

stickfigure wrote: post #24

Article is written by a conservative think tank pushing traditional family values. The statistics might or might not be valid but I wouldn't take their word for it.

Seriously. I don’t understand why nearly every other comment just assumes the headline is true without a second thought.
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