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AI’s coding evolution hinges on collaboration and trust

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Re: AI’s coding evolution hinges on collaboration and trust

#31

Post by jjangkke »

tjr wrote: post #23
jjangkke wrote: post #15

I'm fatigued by these articles that just broadly claim AI can't code because its painting a broad stroke against a widely diverse use of AI for different stacks. It's horribly outdated way of thinking that an singular AI entity would be able to handle all stacks all problems directed at it because no developer is using it that way. AI is a great tool for both coders and artists and these outlandish titles that grab a…

A lot of comments here seem to be similar. I see people claiming that AI has all but taken over doing their work for them, and others claiming that it's almost useless. But usually, nobody even briefly mentions what the work is (other than, presumably, something related to programming). I imagine there's a big difference in using AI for building, say, an online forum vs. building a flight control system, both in term…

I can confidently state that for CRUD web apps, its truly over as in those jobs are never going to command the same wages it once used to.

With the recent models its now encroaching similarly on all fronts, I think the next few iterations we'll see LLM solidify itself as a meta-compiler that will be deployed locally for more FCS type systems.

At the end of the day the hazards are still same with or without AI, you need checks and bounds, you need proper vetting of code and quality but overall it probably doesn't make sense to charge an hourly rate because an AI would drastically cut down such billing schemes.

For me "replacement" is largely a 70~80% reduction in either hourly wages, job positions or both and from the job market data I see it can get there.

Re: AI’s coding evolution hinges on collaboration and trust

#32

Post by biophysboy »

ACCount37 wrote: post #27
manoDev wrote: post #10

I'm tired of the anthropomorphization marketing behind AI driving this kind of discussion. In a few years, all this talk will sound as dumb as stating "MS Word spell checker will replace writers" or "Photoshop will replace designers". We'll reap the productivity benefits from this new tool, create more work for ourselves, output will stabilize at a new level and salaries will stagnate again, as it always happens.

I'm tired of all the "yet another tool" reductionism. It reeks of cope. It took under a decade to get AI to this stage - where it can build small scripts and tiny services entirely on its own. I see no fundamental limitations that would prevent further improvements. I see no reason why it would stop at human level of performance either.

You can’t see any bottlenecks? Energy? Compute power? Model limitations? Data? Money?

Re: AI’s coding evolution hinges on collaboration and trust

#33

Post by tashoecraft »

ACCount37 wrote: post #27
manoDev wrote: post #10

I'm tired of the anthropomorphization marketing behind AI driving this kind of discussion. In a few years, all this talk will sound as dumb as stating "MS Word spell checker will replace writers" or "Photoshop will replace designers". We'll reap the productivity benefits from this new tool, create more work for ourselves, output will stabilize at a new level and salaries will stagnate again, as it always happens.

I'm tired of all the "yet another tool" reductionism. It reeks of cope. It took under a decade to get AI to this stage - where it can build small scripts and tiny services entirely on its own. I see no fundamental limitations that would prevent further improvements. I see no reason why it would stop at human level of performance either.

There’s this saying that humans are terrible at predicting exponential growth. I believe we need another saying, those who expect exponential growth have a tough time not expecting it.

It’s not under a decade for ai to get to this stage but multiple decades of work, with algorithms finally able to take advantage of gpu hardware to massively excel.

There’s already feeling that growth has slowed, I’m not seeing the rise in performance at coding tasks that I saw over the past few years. I see no fundamental improvements that would suggest exponential growth or human level of performance.

Re: AI’s coding evolution hinges on collaboration and trust

#34

Post by SKILNER »

"According to the study, AI still struggles with several crucial facets of coding: sweeping scopes involving huge codebases, the extended context lengths of millions of lines of code, higher levels of logical complexity, and long-horizon or long-term planning about the structure and design of code to maintain code quality."

uhhh, not sure even the best people or teams are very good at this either. Condemning AI for not being capable of something we're not capable of, ok...

“If it takes longer to explain to the system all the things you want to do and all the details of what you want to do, then all you have is just programming by another name.”

This is called the specification process, which hopefully is already occurring today.

There's so much self-serving bias in articles like this, as well as the comments on HN, Reddit, etc. It's good to critique AI, but that self-serving line is frequently crossed by many people.

Re: AI’s coding evolution hinges on collaboration and trust

#35

Post by apercu »

ACCount37 wrote: post #27
manoDev wrote: post #10

I'm tired of the anthropomorphization marketing behind AI driving this kind of discussion. In a few years, all this talk will sound as dumb as stating "MS Word spell checker will replace writers" or "Photoshop will replace designers". We'll reap the productivity benefits from this new tool, create more work for ourselves, output will stabilize at a new level and salaries will stagnate again, as it always happens.

I'm tired of all the "yet another tool" reductionism. It reeks of cope. It took under a decade to get AI to this stage - where it can build small scripts and tiny services entirely on its own. I see no fundamental limitations that would prevent further improvements. I see no reason why it would stop at human level of performance either.

So maybe the truth is somewhere in between - there is no way AI is not going to have a major societal impact - like social media.

If we don't see some serious fencing, I will not be surprised by some spectacular AI-caused failures in the next 3 years that wipe out companies.

Business typically follows a risk-based approach to things, and in this case entire industries are yolo'ing.

Re: AI’s coding evolution hinges on collaboration and trust

#36

Post by biophysboy »

kazinator wrote: post #22
manoDev wrote: post #10

I'm tired of the anthropomorphization marketing behind AI driving this kind of discussion. In a few years, all this talk will sound as dumb as stating "MS Word spell checker will replace writers" or "Photoshop will replace designers". We'll reap the productivity benefits from this new tool, create more work for ourselves, output will stabilize at a new level and salaries will stagnate again, as it always happens.

Generative AI is replacing writers, designers, actors, ... it is nothing like just a spell checker or Phtoshop. Everyday, I see ads on YouTube with smooth-talking, real-looking AI-generated actors. Each one represents one less person that would have been paid. There is no exact measure of correctness in design; one bad bit does not stop the show. The clients don't even want real art. Artists sometimes refer to commer…

YouTube has the lowest quality ads of any online platform I use by several orders of magnitude. AI being used for belly fat and erectile dysfunction ads is not exactly good for its creative reputation

Re: AI’s coding evolution hinges on collaboration and trust

#37

Post by luqtas »

ACCount37 wrote: post #27
manoDev wrote: post #10

I'm tired of the anthropomorphization marketing behind AI driving this kind of discussion. In a few years, all this talk will sound as dumb as stating "MS Word spell checker will replace writers" or "Photoshop will replace designers". We'll reap the productivity benefits from this new tool, create more work for ourselves, output will stabilize at a new level and salaries will stagnate again, as it always happens.

I'm tired of all the "yet another tool" reductionism. It reeks of cope. It took under a decade to get AI to this stage - where it can build small scripts and tiny services entirely on its own. I see no fundamental limitations that would prevent further improvements. I see no reason why it would stop at human level of performance either.

> ... entirely on its own

ok, ok! just like you can find for much less computation power involved using a search engine, forums/websites having if not your question, something similar or a snippet [0] helping you solve your doubt... all of that free of tokens and companies profiting over what the internet have build! even FOSS generative AI can give billions USD to GPU manufacturers

[0] just a silly script that can lead a bunch of logic: https://stackoverflow.com/questions/70058132/how-do-i-make-a...

Re: AI’s coding evolution hinges on collaboration and trust

#38

Post by hitarpetar »

ACCount37 wrote: post #27
manoDev wrote: post #10

I'm tired of the anthropomorphization marketing behind AI driving this kind of discussion. In a few years, all this talk will sound as dumb as stating "MS Word spell checker will replace writers" or "Photoshop will replace designers". We'll reap the productivity benefits from this new tool, create more work for ourselves, output will stabilize at a new level and salaries will stagnate again, as it always happens.

I'm tired of all the "yet another tool" reductionism. It reeks of cope. It took under a decade to get AI to this stage - where it can build small scripts and tiny services entirely on its own. I see no fundamental limitations that would prevent further improvements. I see no reason why it would stop at human level of performance either.

your comment reeks of hype. no evidence whatsoever for your prediction, just an assertion that you personally don't see it not coming true

Re: AI’s coding evolution hinges on collaboration and trust

#39

Post by strangescript »

I think everyone is looking for back and white switches. Either coding agents are writing your code or they aren't. Humans will always be in the mix in some form, but the amount and skills they use is going to be radically different as time goes on.

I personally haven't written any significant code by hand since claude code landed. I also have a high tolerance for prompting and re-prompting. Some of my colleagues would get upset if it wasn't mostly one shotting issues and had a really low tolerance for it going off the rails.

Since gpt-5-high came out, I rarely have to re-prompt. Strong CI pipeline and well defined AGENTS.md goes an incredibly long way.

Re: AI’s coding evolution hinges on collaboration and trust

#40

Post by phailhaus »

ACCount37 wrote: post #27
manoDev wrote: post #10

I'm tired of the anthropomorphization marketing behind AI driving this kind of discussion. In a few years, all this talk will sound as dumb as stating "MS Word spell checker will replace writers" or "Photoshop will replace designers". We'll reap the productivity benefits from this new tool, create more work for ourselves, output will stabilize at a new level and salaries will stagnate again, as it always happens.

I'm tired of all the "yet another tool" reductionism. It reeks of cope. It took under a decade to get AI to this stage - where it can build small scripts and tiny services entirely on its own. I see no fundamental limitations that would prevent further improvements. I see no reason why it would stop at human level of performance either.

> I see no fundamental limitations

How about the fact that AI is only trained to complete text and literally has no "mind" within which to conceive or reason about concepts? Fundamentally, it is only trained to sound like a human.

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