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It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

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Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#271

Post by halz »

geor9e wrote: post #236
avidiax wrote: post #10

Employers, even the rich FANG types, are quite penny-wise and pound-foolish when it comes to developer hardware. Limiting the number and size of monitors. Putting speedbumps (like assessments or doctor's notes) on ergo accessories. Requiring special approval for powerful hardware. Requiring special approval for travel, and setting hotel and airfare caps that haven't been adjusted for inflation. To be fair, I know ple…

I know a FAANG company whose IT department, for the last few years, has been "out of stock" for SSD drives over 250GB . They claim its a global market issue (it's not). There's constant complaining in the chats for folks who compile locally. The engineers make $300k+ so they just buy a second SSD from Amazon on their credit cards and self-install them without mentioning it to the IT dept. I've never heard a rational…

I've wondered if that's to make dealing with full disk backup/forensic collections/retention legal hold/etc easier: keep the official amount of end-user device storage to a minimum. And/or it forces the endpoint to depend on network/cloud storage, giving better business intelligence on what data is "hot".

Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#273

Post by burnt-resistor »

sgarland wrote: post #98

Tangential: TIL you can compile the Linux kernel in < 1 minute (on top-spec hardware). Seems it’s been a while since I’ve done that, because I remember it being more like an hour or more.

In 2003, Egenera boxes could compile Linux in around 15 seconds.

Even my dual 7402 with 96 threads and 512 GiB of RAM can't compile a maximal Linux config x86 build in RAM in under 3 minutes.

What I find helps repeated builds is maintaining a memcache server instance for sccache.

Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#274

Post by add-sub-mul-div »

krisroadruck wrote: post #116
jhanschoo wrote: post #26

Important caveat that the author neglects to mention since they are discussing laptop CPUs in the same breath: The limiting factor on high-end laptops is their thermal envelope. Get the better CPU as long as it is more power efficient. Then get brands that design proper thermal solutions.

You simply cannot cram enough cooling and power into a laptop to have it equal a desktop high end desktop CPU of the same generation. There is physically not enough room. Just about the only way to even approach that would be to have liquid cooling loop ports out the back that you had to plug into an under-desk cooling loop and I don't think anyone is doing that because at that point just get a frickin desktop comput…

> I honestly do not understand why so many devs seem to insist on doing work on a laptop.

Their employers made it the culture so that working from home/vacation would be easy.

Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#275

Post by bigstrat2003 »

baq wrote: post #133
Aurornis wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every well funded startup I’ve worked for went through a period where employees could get nearly anything they asked for: New computers, more monitors, special chairs, standing desks, SaaS software, DoorDash when working late. If engineers said they needed it, they got it. Then some period of time later they start looking at spending in detail and can’t believe how much is being spent by the 25% or so who abuse the p…

> individuals incurring expenses in the tens of thousands range peanuts compared to their 500k TC

Not only are most developers (let alone other employees) making nowhere near that, why should spending $500k mean you waste $10k? Even saving small amounts matters when you add it up.

Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#276

Post by Tsiklon »

brookst wrote: post #209
Tsiklon wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Generally PCI-E lanes and memory bandwidth tend to be the big difference between mobile and proper desktop workstation processors. Core count used to be a big difference but the ARM Procs in the Apple machines certainly meet the lower end workstation parts now. to exceed it you're spending big big money to get high core counts in the x86 space. Proper desktop processors have lots and lots of PCI-E Lanes. The current…

The M4 Max’s bus width is 512 bytes, not 64.

Aha! That'll definitely get you to 546G/s.

Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#277

Post by necovek »

appreciatorBus wrote: post #263
necovek wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If $20k is misspent by 1 in 100 employees, that's still $200 per employee per year: peanuts, really. Just like with "policing", I'd only focus on uncovering and dealing with abusers after the fact, not on everyone — giving most people "benefits" that instead makes them feel valued.

So then just set a limit of $200 per head instead of allowing a few bad apples to spend $20k all on themselves.

This was extra on top of whatever the average cost really is for employees who are not abusing the system.

So, if other engineers get their equipment for $6k (beefed-up laptop, 32" or 30" 5k widescreen screen, ergonomic chair, standing desk — in theory amortized over 3-10 years, but really, on the retention period which is usually Maybe not peanuts, but the cost of administration to oversee spending and the cost to employees to provide proof and follow due process (in their hourly rate for time used) will quickly add up and usually negate any "savings" from stopping abuse altogether — since now everybody needs to shoulder the cost.

Any type of cap based on average means that those who needed something more special-cased (more powerful machine, more RAM vs CPU/storage, more expensive ergonomic setup due to their anatomy [eg. significantly taller than average]...) can't really get it anymore.

Obviously, having no cap and requiring manager approval is usually enough to get rid of almost all abuse, though it is sometimes important to be able to predict expenses throughout the year.

Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#278

Post by dcrazy »

incone123 wrote: post #239
ffsm8 wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stability is a big one, but the feel of the desk itself is also a price point. You're gonna be paying a lot depending on the type of tabletop you get. ($100-1k+ just for the top)

Mine is very stable. Top is just some kind of board. It took a bit of damage from my cat's claws but that's not a risk most corporate offices have.

What price point did you buy at?

I paid a premium for my home height-adjustable desk because the frame and top are made in America, the veneer is much thicker than competitors, the motors and worm gears are reliable, and the same company makes coordinating office furniture.

The same company sells cheap imported desks too. Since my work area is next to the dining table in my open-plan apartment, I considered the better looks worth the extra money.

Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#279

Post by necovek »

add-sub-mul-div wrote: post #274
krisroadruck wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You simply cannot cram enough cooling and power into a laptop to have it equal a desktop high end desktop CPU of the same generation. There is physically not enough room. Just about the only way to even approach that would be to have liquid cooling loop ports out the back that you had to plug into an under-desk cooling loop and I don't think anyone is doing that because at that point just get a frickin desktop comput…

> I honestly do not understand why so many devs seem to insist on doing work on a laptop. Their employers made it the culture so that working from home/vacation would be easy.

A better look at it is to say that they started allowing working from home.

I've worked fully remotely in a couple of global remote-first company since 2006 for a decade-plus — it was my choice how I wanted to set up my working conditions, with company paying for a "laptop refresh" every 3 years which I did not have to use on a laptop.

Re: It is worth it to buy the fast CPU

#280

Post by bigstrat2003 »

LevGoldstein wrote: post #258
alt227 wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they care that much about compile time, they would work on a desktop instead of a laptop.

...and we're back to trying to convince a penny-wise pound-foolish company to buy twice the computing hardware for every developer.

Or just buy everyone desktops. Honestly I think laptops are completely superfluous for every business I've ever worked at. Nobody is truly getting value out of bringing a laptop to meetings, they just like them.
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