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The End of Handwriting

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Re: The End of Handwriting

#281

Post by watwut »

bayindirh wrote: post #265
watwut wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not that person, but because there is an option to use a keyboard and easily edit, reread, reedir and again. As why go in circles in own head when I can be moving forward with keyboard.

In this age of keyboards, cloud computing and AI, we think being fast is better. We lost our patience, and want everything instantly. However, there are some processes which needs time. Life is same everywhere. It makes the same trade-offs. Fast growing plants have less mass, they are less dense, and if they are edible, they're less delicious and nutritious. However, hard woods, strong plants and nutritiously dense f…

> Fast growing plants have less mass, they are less dense, and if they are edible, they're less delicious and nutritious.

I suspect you made that up. Mint grows fast and tastes great. Watermelon grows super fast and tastes super great. And plenty of slow growing plants are plain inedible.

It is not even clear what you mean by "nutritious dense". But, my family used to grow both vegetables, fruits and even potatoes/herbs. Speed of growing and how nutritious or tasty they are does not seem all that much correlated to me.

> When you let your brain draw circles on an idea, you start to prune its illogical parts.

You will prune them even gaster and more reliably when you see own thoughts written.

Re: The End of Handwriting

#282

Post by nuancebydefault »

IAmBroom wrote: post #186
XorNot wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Teaching cursive seems like a weirdly American obsession, because during school in Australia it just...wasn't a thing. Like teachers did take you through what "running writing" was, but we were never required to actually master it the accomplishments level was just "can you write? Good let's move on to how sentences are structured".

Fascinating! Can anyone from other countries chime in?

Belgium: the only handwriting i can do properly is cursive (each word is a connected string of curly letters). I often cheated on the capitals because they are a bit grandose curly in cursive. We wrote notebooks full with cursive in different languages, that's how most languages were thought. My 12yo kid was thought exactly the same hand writing but he has to write less because the usage of fill-in books in stead of empty notebooks.

Re: The End of Handwriting

#283

Post by nuancebydefault »

odyssey7 wrote: post #67

As a CS student, the way I learned things I needed to memorize was by writing it down / copying / summarizing on paper and studying from that. It’s a little ridiculous to reframe that a significant part of my education was an exercise in copying information over by hand, but it’s just true that this method reliably worked for me. Also: my reading speed was ungodly slow. I think I considered it typical to spend 3 hour…

I find it odd that some people find that way of teaching/learning odd.

Re: The End of Handwriting

#284

Post by nuancebydefault »

aaronbaugher wrote: post #171
odyssey7 wrote: post #67

As a CS student, the way I learned things I needed to memorize was by writing it down / copying / summarizing on paper and studying from that. It’s a little ridiculous to reframe that a significant part of my education was an exercise in copying information over by hand, but it’s just true that this method reliably worked for me. Also: my reading speed was ungodly slow. I think I considered it typical to spend 3 hour…

Aside from learning, I also find that pen-and-paper is much more effective for journaling, when I want to work through a problem or brainstorm something. Once I've worked it out, I'll often type it in so I've got it saved in a searchable, archivable form. But putting it on paper first seems to help me think about it. It's like I see the words in a deeper way than when I'm putting them on the screen.

The thing is, writing on paper is much slower and hurtful than typing, but then again maybe that's the point when the goal is to keep it brain-stored and understood.

Re: The End of Handwriting

#285

Post by dsubburam »

bayindirh wrote: post #63
tbrownaw wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, fountain pens have a "cool" factor and can be made for decorative stuff, but that's it. Sure the super cheap bic pens that come in boxes of 100 aren't great, but that's because they're cheap (besides being inexpensive). Something like those G2 gel pens that are also available everywhere for not very much (fairly inexpensive, but not pejorative-cheap) these days work just fine.

> No, fountain pens have a "cool" factor and can be made for decorative stuff, but that's it. I would not disagree more. A fountain pen writes with zero pressure. In contrast modern rollerballs and gel pens have a little spring to prevent contact leaking. Uni might have a patent on that. Famously Pilot's Hi-Techpoint pens doesn't have that and it stains the place where it touches. A fountain pen can outlast any dispo…

Also, a fountain pen can be held at a smaller angle to the paper. Unlike the other kinds of pens, it even tends to write better that way. I find the smaller angle more comfortable to hold.

Re: The End of Handwriting

#286

Post by nuancebydefault »

tiborsaas wrote: post #187
voidUpdate wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a left handed person, fountain pens are basically a no-go. What actually helped improve my handwriting was not doing cursive, but writing each letter individually, which forces me to pause between each letter. Still using the lower case forms (though I did try all caps for a while), but just forcing myself to slow down. Still have problems with 9 vs 4 though

I'm also left handed and the closest thing I've found to fountain pens are rollerball pens, it's very smooth and easy to write with them, they are sharp and dry instantly.

I'm confused. The only thing both have in common is that they are pens. For the rest they are on opposite ends of the pen spectrum. Unless a pencil or a felt tip are called pens as well?

Re: The End of Handwriting

#287

Post by nuancebydefault »

loloquwowndueo wrote: post #108
swannodette wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m left handed, with the right ink and paper this isn’t a huge problem. I picked up fountain pens a year ago and I will never go back to regular pens for my own writing.

Please share what the right fountain pen, ink and paper would be for a left-handed person to avoid smearing everything to kingdom come! (Asking with honest curiosity as a fellow leftie who would love to be able to use a fountain pen). I swear by uniball jet stream pens, they feel much nicer than a ball point and dry fast enough for me to use them but would love a true fountain pen setup instead!

A big advantage of fountain pens is that when the ink is not dry yet you can easily erase the color chemically with another type of pen.

Re: The End of Handwriting

#288

Post by tsunagatta »

loloquwowndueo wrote: post #108
swannodette wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m left handed, with the right ink and paper this isn’t a huge problem. I picked up fountain pens a year ago and I will never go back to regular pens for my own writing.

Please share what the right fountain pen, ink and paper would be for a left-handed person to avoid smearing everything to kingdom come! (Asking with honest curiosity as a fellow leftie who would love to be able to use a fountain pen). I swear by uniball jet stream pens, they feel much nicer than a ball point and dry fast enough for me to use them but would love a true fountain pen setup instead!

Look into Noodler’s Bernake Black ink, it dries very very quickly and I’ve used it as a lefty for years with no problems.

Re: The End of Handwriting

#289

Post by robocat »

deadbabe wrote: post #178
giancarlostoro wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lol I have a friend whose handwriting was so bad, his mom found the leading expert in teaching how to write correctly (at the time / wherever he lived at the time), that eventually broke him and he gave up. We are all very unique and different. What's funny is I gave up on cursive as long as I hit the internet in the mid 2000s because I instinctively knew it was fruitless.

You must know how to at least read cursive, otherwise you will see a word like minimum written in cursive and think it’s just a scribble.

I could imagine a web page saying "you must be over 50." to enter this page. A capture saying Please read this cursive script and type in what it says...

Re: The End of Handwriting

#290

Post by StableAlkyne »

ChickeNES wrote: post #263
StableAlkyne wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fountains also feel incredibly good to write with once you find the right nib + pen + ink combo you prefer. Deliberate practice is the #1 way to get better at most skills, and making the activity feel good will encourage that: if it feels good to write, you'll probably be more deliberate when doing it and really think about the strokes you're making. Then you have a few "oh hey, if I do this with this part of the let…

See, here's what I don't get: Who wants to go through the trouble? Buying tons of nibs, pens, inks, and paper to find one I like, when I go months without even picking up a normal pencil or pen? I'm really curious what people are still writing by hands these days, especially where others would have the ability to comment on it. I don't think I've even used a pen for a signature in god knows, since all the doctor's of…

At least for me, it was back when I was taking classes in college and writing a lot of notes. Made it easy to try a bunch of pens and inks. That said, just try a few. You don't have to be systematic or spend a bunch. I like fine tips, so any fine tip is fine with me.

That, and I keep a written log of what I do during a day. Helps with annual performance reviews and to answer the question of "wait didn't I do X a week ago?" I guess I could migrate to a text file or something, but that's a lot more restrictive of a format than just writing.

Plus, my notebook isn't going to suddenly run out of battery in the middle of a string of meetings. And if my pen goes dry - just find whatever ballpoint or pencil is around, nbd.

That said, nobody's forcing you to write or whatever. People enjoy different things, and that's okay.

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