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Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

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Re: Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

#181

Post by einarfd »

pixelesque wrote: post #132
timeattack wrote: post #75

Advances in generative AI are making me progressively more and more depressive. Creativity is taken from us at exponential rate. And I don't buy argument from people who are saying they are excited to live in this age. I can get that if that technology stopped at current state and remained to be just tools for our creative endeavours, but it doesn't seem to be an endgame here. Instead it aims to be a complete replace…

What's interesting to me along these lines is I assume most of the companies funding the research are targeting the "creative" media in terms of image generation, music generation, avatars, speach, etc. I can understand it's very interesting from a researcher's point-of-view (I'm a software dev who's worked adjacent to some ML researchers doing pipeline stuff to integrate models into software), but at the same time:…

There are companies out there working on those problems as well. How the funding climate for them are. I don't know. But the market for smart robots, should be gigantic. So there must be some. Keep in mind that what is easy, and hard for a human, which is the result of billions of years of evolution. Isn't necessary the same things that are hard or easy for our technologies.

Re: Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

#182

Post by schmidtleonard »

casenmgreen wrote: post #162
diwank wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Future robots may learn in their dreams... So prescient. I definitely think this will be a thing in the near future ~12-18 months time horizon

I may be wrong, but this seems to make no sense. A neural net can produce information outside of its original data set, but it is all and directly derived from that initial set. There are fundamental information constraints here. You cannot use a neural net to itself generate from its existing data set wholly new and original full quality training data for itself. You can use a neural net to generate data, and you ca…

We are miles away from the fundamental constraint. We know that our current training methodologies are scandalously data inefficient compared to human/animal brains. Augmenting observations with dreams has long been theorized to be (part of) the answer.

Re: Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

#184

Post by glenstein »

pantalaimon wrote: post #164
glenstein wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>We don't inherit any software, so cognitive function must bootstrap itself from it's underlying structure alone. Hardware and software, as metaphors applied to biology, I think are better understood as a continuum than a binary, and if we don't inherit any software (is that true?), we at least inherit assembly code.

> we don't inherit any software (is that true?), we at least inherit assembly code To stay with the metaphor, DNA could be rather understood as firmware that runs on the cell. What I mean with software is the 'mind' that runs on a collection of cells. Things like language, thoughts and ideas. There is also a second level of software that runs not on a single mind alone, but collection of minds, to form cliques or a s…

I think we have some notion of a proto-grammar or ability to linguistically conceptualize, probably at the level of some primordial conceptual units that are more fundamental than language, thoughts and ideas in the concrete forms we generally understand them to have.

I think it's like Chomsky said, that we don't learn this infrastructure for understanding language any more than a bird "learns" their feathers. But I might be losing track of what you're suggesting is software in the metaphor. I think I'm broadly on board with your characterization of DNA, the mind and memes generally though.

Re: Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

#185

Post by pizzathyme »

michalf6 wrote: post #179
timeattack wrote: post #75

Advances in generative AI are making me progressively more and more depressive. Creativity is taken from us at exponential rate. And I don't buy argument from people who are saying they are excited to live in this age. I can get that if that technology stopped at current state and remained to be just tools for our creative endeavours, but it doesn't seem to be an endgame here. Instead it aims to be a complete replace…

Nick Land kind of took this line of reasoning to its ultimate conclusion, I recommend giving his ideas a read even if they sound repulsive. "Nothing human makes it out of the near-future."

I've tried and failed to find a good starting point for his ideas. Do you recommend any?

Re: Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

#186

Post by Bjorkbat »

Bjorkbat wrote: post #166

Genuinely technically impressive, but I have a weird issue with calling these world simulator models. To me, they're video game simulator models. I've only ever seen demos of these models where things happen from a first-person or 3rd-person perspective, often in the sort of context where you are controlling some sort of playable avatar. I've never seen a demo where they prompted a model to simulate a forest ecology…

Also, to drive my point further home, in one of the demos they were operating a jetski during a festival. If the jetski bumps into a small Chinese lantern, it will move the lantern. Impressive. However, when the jetski bumped into some sort of floating structure the structure itself was completely unaffected while the jetski simply stopped moving.

This is a pretty clear example of video game physics at work. In the real world, both the jetski and floating structure would be much more affected by a collision, but in the context of video game physics such an interaction makes sense.

So yeah, it's a video game simulator, not a world simulator.

Re: Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

#187

Post by Terretta »

dandellion wrote: post #71
brotchie wrote: post #9

First AI thing that’s made me feel a bit of derealization… …and this is the worst the capabilities will ever be. Watching the video created a glimmer of doubt that perhaps my current reality is a future version of myself, or some other consciousness, that’s living its life in an AI hallucinated environment.

I suggest you go to google/bing/whatever floats your boat and search "it will only get better" then filter results earlier than 2010. Things that I just found that were going to "only get better": - Google search - Web browsers - Web content - Internet Explorer - Music - Flight process at Mosul airport - Star Wars

> Star Wars

And then you watched Mandalorian and Andor?

Jokes aside, Google Search results are worse thanks to so much web content being just ad scaffolding, but the interesting one here is music.

Music is typically imagined to be its best at whatever ages one most listened to it, partly trained in and partly thanks to meanings/memories/nostalgia attached to it. As a consequence, for most everyone, more recent music seems to be “getting worse”!

That said, and back to the SEO effect on Google Results, I'd argue mass distribution/advertising/marketing has resulted in most audio airtime getting objectively* less complex, but if one turns off the mass distribution, and looks around, there seems to be plenty of just as good — even building on what came before — music to be found.

* https://www.researchgate.net/publication/387975100_Decoding_...

Re: Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

#188

Post by sureglymop »

dingnuts wrote: post #148
neom wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm invested in a startup that is doing something unrelated robotics, but they're spending a lot of time in Shenzhen, I keep a very close eye on robotics and was talking to their CTO about what he is seeing in China, versions of this are already being implemented.

[flagged]

I have no doubts that is the case. Just look at this new Unitree robot that was unveiled a mere 6 hours ago: https://youtu.be/ve9USu7zpLU?feature=shared

And these are consumer options, affordable to you and me, not only to some military. If those are the commonly available options... there may be way more advanced stuff that we haven't seen.

Re: Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

#189

Post by schmidtleonard »

dingnuts wrote: post #148
neom wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm invested in a startup that is doing something unrelated robotics, but they're spending a lot of time in Shenzhen, I keep a very close eye on robotics and was talking to their CTO about what he is seeing in China, versions of this are already being implemented.

[flagged]

This is so standard it's part of the tutorials now

https://developer.nvidia.com/isaac/gr00t

Re: Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

#190

Post by neom »

casenmgreen wrote: post #162
diwank wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Future robots may learn in their dreams... So prescient. I definitely think this will be a thing in the near future ~12-18 months time horizon

I may be wrong, but this seems to make no sense. A neural net can produce information outside of its original data set, but it is all and directly derived from that initial set. There are fundamental information constraints here. You cannot use a neural net to itself generate from its existing data set wholly new and original full quality training data for itself. You can use a neural net to generate data, and you ca…

I might be misunderstanding your comment so sorry if so. Robots have sensors and RL is a thing, they can collect real world data and then processing and consolidating real world experiences during downtime (or in real time), running simulations to prepare for scenarios, and updating models based on the day's collected data. The way I saw it that I thought was impressive was the robot understood the scene, but didn't know how the scene would respond to it's actions, so it gens videos of the possible scenarios, and then picks the best ones and models it's actuation based on it's "imagination".
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