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We may not like what we become if A.I. solves loneliness

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Re: We may not like what we become if A.I. solves loneliness

#201

Post by DoneWithAllThat »

IgorPartola wrote: post #142
stdvit wrote: post #97

> Even in a world brimming with easy distractions—TikTok, Pornhub, Candy Crush, Sudoku—people still manage to meet for drinks, work out at the gym, go on dates, muddle through real life. They actually don't. Everything from dating and fitness to manufacturing and politics is in decline in activities, and more so in effect and understanding. You can't convince (enough) people anymore that it is even important as many…

I’d like to offer an alternative explanation than AI to this. Shit is just too damn expensive. If you want to go hang out with friends it will cost you $4-8 for a cup of coffee. A dinner starts at $50/person. A trip to an amusement park is over $100 easily. The median individual income in the US currently is just over $65k/year or about $32.50/hour. That means half the workforce makes less than that. When an 8oz cock…

This excuse is so tiresome. Generations before you lived through far worse than whatever supposed hell you doom scrolled your way into believing. The world is literally better than it’s ever been. Go experience it instead of complaining about vibes.

Re: We may not like what we become if A.I. solves loneliness

#202

Post by benreesman »

dclowd9901 wrote: post #184
xtracto wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a 44 yo Xenial, not too old, not young. That is, I'm part of the "walkman generation" . It surprises me how people are less and less open to socialize, to the point that some even see you with disgust if you DARE to interrupt them from.their mobile phone trance. Society nowadays is pretty ugly. Younger generations seem very isolationist to me.

Same gen (42). I feel like we have a really unique lens on all of this, too: old enough to remember being in a smoky bar, socializing (not healthy, but fun as hell), but also young enough to have had some technological exposure at a crucial time of our youth. We _leveraged_ technology for socializing in person. Our online pursuits were around organizing lighthearted social goofiness like "getting iced", LARPing, and…

I'm about to be 41 and likewise very distinctly remember a time when cell phones were a vehicle for organizing the evening or weekend's plans, quickly making a connection with someone you met ("let me get your number"), whatever, buying weed or something. The point was to make friends, get laid, network without calling it that. The idea was that some of those random people would become your crew of friends, one of those girls would become your wife, and you'd end up settled down to kick off the next generation. And I know some people who did end up settled dowm...but not that many, not like the generation right before mine. Kind of hit or miss in my cohort.

Near as I can tell that was still roughly the model on paper if less and less until COVID and lockdown and all that. Something snapped, you can see it walking down the street of any city you knew well before. People never came back outside with the same vigor.

I don't claim to understand the causal structure between all the various factors: the bleak economic prospects, the decline in institutions, the increasingly rapacious and cynical Big Tech cabal, there are a ton of factors.

But COVID before and after, that's when it collectively became too much to easily bounce back from.

Re: We may not like what we become if A.I. solves loneliness

#203

Post by soulofmischief »

IgorPartola wrote: post #142
stdvit wrote: post #97

> Even in a world brimming with easy distractions—TikTok, Pornhub, Candy Crush, Sudoku—people still manage to meet for drinks, work out at the gym, go on dates, muddle through real life. They actually don't. Everything from dating and fitness to manufacturing and politics is in decline in activities, and more so in effect and understanding. You can't convince (enough) people anymore that it is even important as many…

I’d like to offer an alternative explanation than AI to this. Shit is just too damn expensive. If you want to go hang out with friends it will cost you $4-8 for a cup of coffee. A dinner starts at $50/person. A trip to an amusement park is over $100 easily. The median individual income in the US currently is just over $65k/year or about $32.50/hour. That means half the workforce makes less than that. When an 8oz cock…

In my state is the federal minimum of $7.25/hr. You're looking at two hours of work for one cocktail.

And my state is addicted to alcohol. The overwhelming majority of people I know in this state won't even meet up with you if there's not a beer waiting for them. People work all week and then spend half their paycheck in one night, then rinse, wash, repeat.

I consider the state of affairs here to be nothing short of abject poverty.

I look around at the declining, unmaintained infrastructure, I hear youth talk about how so many establishments have closed and how if you don't have money there is nothing to do, and you get harassed at parks (I have personally had the police pull up and accost me for just existing at a park) so the only thing left to do is get into mischief, unless you just don't want social contact with your peers. I tell people it looks and feels worse than post-Soviet Eastern Europe out here in Louisiana.

Re: We may not like what we become if A.I. solves loneliness

#204

Post by miki123211 »

kylecazar wrote: post #159

AI is incapable of solving loneliness. It's a biological signal we have (thanks to evolution) to seek social connections with other humans , for things like reproduction and survival. Mentally healthy people will never be less lonely as long as they know they are talking to a model. All it can offer is a distraction and an illusion, because it has no humanity. Note: I don't even think dogs solve loneliness. They can…

> as long as they know they are talking to a model

Any evidence for this?

It's obvious that a sufficiently advanced AI could solve loneliness if it was allowed to present as human, you just wouldn't know it isn't one. I'm entirely unconvinced that something which seems human in all respects couldn't replace one, even if your brain knows that it's actually AI.

Re: We may not like what we become if A.I. solves loneliness

#205

Post by yunwal »

monktastic1 wrote: post #195
gchamonlive wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I second that. Everybody is quick to jump the gun and blame the victim, while all this can be easily explained by the insane lifestyle we are forced to subscribe in order to survive in this crazy cut-throat productivist job market.

I wouldn't be so quick to divide the world so neatly into victims and perpetrators. Every FAANG engineer I know, for example, could easily retire by mid-40s by keeping consumption in check. Instead, nearly every single one chose instead to "improve their lifestyles." Not blaming them, either, because it's cultural programming -- but until we all learn to slow down a bit and reflect, the madness isn't going to stop.

What are you going to do when you retire by 40 and all your friends (and s/o) are still working? I don’t really understand the appeal.

Re: We may not like what we become if A.I. solves loneliness

#206

Post by doug_durham »

CooCooCaCha wrote: post #147
anovikov wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

None of what you described is a scam. Time and again, I’ve found the people who are critical of dieting aren’t doing it right… Which is hard for me to wrap my head around since weight loss boils down to one factor, caloric restriction. You burn more calories than you eat and you lose weight. It’s that simple. All these tricks people use like glp-1 inhibitors and keto all serve the same goal of caloric restriction. GL…

My experience aligns with yours. Words like "discipline" come off as moralistic. I know very disciplined people who struggle to lose weight. As someone who lost 40 lbs through long term fixation on calorie counting and exercise, I find it confusing. However when I look in the mirror and consider what I do to maintain my weight I realize that I'm the outlier. It is unrealistic to expect others to adopt my odd lifestyle.

Re: We may not like what we become if A.I. solves loneliness

#207

Post by ido »

profsummergig wrote: post #177
IgorPartola wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not saying you are wrong but from what I understood that alcoholism and depression were quite prevalent in those times. Do you have sources for what you are saying?

An undiagnosed alcoholic (IMHO) I used to know, would happily spend 6 hours any evening, drinking with anyone, gossiping about completely useless things. They could be doing this with complete strangers whom they would never meet again, they could even be doing this with someone visiting to let them know that they were going to sue them (actually happened at least once). They thought they were very "social". Yeah, if…

Aside from the drinking, what is wrong with the social activity you just mentioned? Or was your point that they only used it as an excuse to drink? Cause it would have surely been easier & cheaper to just drink at home on their own.

Re: We may not like what we become if A.I. solves loneliness

#208

Post by taormina »

johnfn wrote: post #194
IgorPartola wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d like to offer an alternative explanation than AI to this. Shit is just too damn expensive. If you want to go hang out with friends it will cost you $4-8 for a cup of coffee. A dinner starts at $50/person. A trip to an amusement park is over $100 easily. The median individual income in the US currently is just over $65k/year or about $32.50/hour. That means half the workforce makes less than that. When an 8oz cock…

I don't buy this explanation. There are plenty of things you can do together that don't cost very much - or anything at all. You can go take a hike. You can go to the park and hang out, or play a board game. You can go to a court and play pickleball. Heck, go to the library! All these things are free and many people do them.

Gas costs money. The car costs money. You can only do the same hike that's an hour away so many times, before you're traveling to go to new places, and hotels cost money at that point. Pickleball courts cost money. The pickleball equipment costs money. People do go to the library, and then they go home and don't interact with other people.

Re: We may not like what we become if A.I. solves loneliness

#209

Post by calebkaiser »

rayiner wrote: post #155
IgorPartola wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d like to offer an alternative explanation than AI to this. Shit is just too damn expensive. If you want to go hang out with friends it will cost you $4-8 for a cup of coffee. A dinner starts at $50/person. A trip to an amusement park is over $100 easily. The median individual income in the US currently is just over $65k/year or about $32.50/hour. That means half the workforce makes less than that. When an 8oz cock…

Coal miners in 1890s appalachia had healthier and more active social lives than american white collar workers. This does not have anything to do with economics.

The 1890s were the launching point for widespread unionization among coal miners in places like my home-state of Kentucky. Company towns were increasingly common, and major motivations for unionization were to combat things like being paid in company skrip or letting neighborhood kids ("breaker boys" as young as 8) work in the mines. Their social lives--from their neighborhood, to their social "clubs", to the literal currency they were able to use--were entirely defined by their job and the company they worked for.

Tough to use them as proof that this "doesn't have anything to do with economics" when their entire social life was defined by the economics of coal mining.

Re: We may not like what we become if A.I. solves loneliness

#210

Post by twoodfin »

dismalaf wrote: post #176
rayiner wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Coal miners in 1890s appalachia had healthier and more active social lives than american white collar workers. This does not have anything to do with economics.

I'd wager those coal miners spent a lot less (relatively) on housing and had cheap venues to socialize.

Real per capita disposable income has been on a steady upward trend for decades:

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/A229RX0

Unless socialization activities like bars or athletics are major outliers, it seems likely that in income-relative terms, the average American has much cheaper access to social activities.

(Unrelated, but if you squint at that chart you can see why Trump got elected, almost & then actually reelected.)

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