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Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

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Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#771

Post by Swizec »

stavros wrote: post #686
Swizec wrote: post #672

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The EV slows down much more quickly when slowing down, to the point where it's a good replacement for the brake Are you comparing to an automatic ICE or a manual? In my experience of driving EVs their engine braking is sub-par to what I'm used to at least from my motorcycle. Bikes have silly high compression compared to their weight. You def have to be careful about chopping the throttle.

An automatic, with a manual you can shift down to whatever you want, so there's no standard there, really.

Agree the engine braking on automatics sucks. If you re-read my original post, it specifically talked about manuals :)

And I mean if drifters can use shift lock to literally skid their wheels, then clearly engine braking is effective.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#772

Post by stavros »

Swizec wrote: post #771
stavros wrote: post #686

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An automatic, with a manual you can shift down to whatever you want, so there's no standard there, really.

Agree the engine braking on automatics sucks. If you re-read my original post, it specifically talked about manuals :) And I mean if drifters can use shift lock to literally skid their wheels, then clearly engine braking is effective.

With manuals I don't tend to downshift to brake. I certainly could, but it's so jarring (mostly the sudden rev) that I tend to just use the brakes, and what matters is what people do, not what they could do.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#773

Post by Swizec »

stavros wrote: post #772
Swizec wrote: post #771

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agree the engine braking on automatics sucks. If you re-read my original post, it specifically talked about manuals :) And I mean if drifters can use shift lock to literally skid their wheels, then clearly engine braking is effective.

With manuals I don't tend to downshift to brake. I certainly could, but it's so jarring (mostly the sudden rev) that I tend to just use the brakes, and what matters is what people do, not what they could do.

I am talking about what I do do :)

Also I learned in driving school in Europe (and during the motorcycle course in USA) to downshift while braking so your engine helps the brakes and you’re always in the right gear. There shouldn’t be any sudden revs if you’re gentle with the clutch.

Then again as a young idiot I also learned how to heel-and-toe on public roads so I could rev match more effectively while braking into corners. Maybe I’m just a weird driver with unusual habits. It’s ok.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#774

Post by michaelcampbell »

SR2Z wrote: post #735
usrusr wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On paper, yes, but did that ever happen? Sorry for being sarcastic, but where I live the frugal hybrid is exceptionally rare and the "same big engine, but driving a much heavier car" hybrid is omnipresent. The kind of people who might buy the frugal one buy second or third hand while almost all buyers of factory new pick the "same big engine" option, and those are the ones who decide what's available on the second ha…

I've never seen a car where the hybrid and pure gas versions have the same size engine; the hybrid engine is almost always lighter and makes less power.

Dunno if you consider plugin hybrids hybrids, but I believe the Audi Q5 PHEV and ICE-only engines are the same.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#775

Post by michaelcampbell »

chakintosh wrote: post #385
nine_k wrote: post #41

I suppose the same should apply to hybrid cars, which outnumber pure EVs significantly [1]. The effect comes from converting the kinetic energy back to the battery charge via generation instead of wasting it via friction, which is the whole point of hybrids. [1]: https://www.consumeraffairs.com/automotive/how-many-electric...

On both my Volvo PHEVs I often look at the brake discs and find them rusty from the amount of regen braking. it almost completely eliminates conventional braking unless it's for collision avoidance.

Brake rotors will noticeably rust overnight if left in wet conditions.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#776

Post by bartread »

guywithahat wrote: post #560
bartread wrote: post #386

In four years of plug-in hybrid ownership, and maybe 50k miles, I haven’t even had to replace pads, and the car wasn’t new when I bought it. I even commented on the longevity at the dealership the last time I took it for a service, and they said they see it a lot with hybrids. The regen braking really does make a huge difference.

Is 50k a lot? I drove my ford fiesta 120k without changing the pads. I'm certain the motor helps, but assuming it's a relatively lightweight vehicle I don't think you should be changing pads that much unless you're an aggressive driver

> aggressive driver

Hi.

Although I’d call it spirited rather than aggressive. I’m not out to intimidate people or drive dangerously: but when I have the space and time I enjoy throwing a car around.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#777

Post by photon_rancher »

SR2Z wrote: post #735
usrusr wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On paper, yes, but did that ever happen? Sorry for being sarcastic, but where I live the frugal hybrid is exceptionally rare and the "same big engine, but driving a much heavier car" hybrid is omnipresent. The kind of people who might buy the frugal one buy second or third hand while almost all buyers of factory new pick the "same big engine" option, and those are the ones who decide what's available on the second ha…

I've never seen a car where the hybrid and pure gas versions have the same size engine; the hybrid engine is almost always lighter and makes less power.

There’s a few luxury cars that use the same or larger engines for the hybrid. Lexus did it with the LS, hybrid 600h had a larger engine (5L) than the gas 460 (4.6L).

Those are super rare though.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#778

Post by photon_rancher »

Swizec wrote: post #669
yreg wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And how often did you engine break with that ICE car when driving around the city? Because I did it only when driving down extreme slopes. It also cannot do a full stop. With an EV I don't touch breaks unless in situations I fail to/couldn't predict (maybe up to 10% of all speed reductions and even less stops).

> And how often did you engine break with that ICE car when driving around the city? Oh all the time. I used to drive like a typical youth. I've been in USA for 10 years now and still hate driving automatics because they shift into too high a gear and then you have to constantly use the brakes. It's annoying.

Most autos have an override to shift manually and engine brake more, hardly ever see people use them except if they tow frequently though.

A lot of CVTs have virtual gears for that even, although others like the prius only have B mode.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#779

Post by gnarlouse »

kingstnap wrote: post #446
gnarlouse wrote: post #134

But they burn through tires much faster due to the battery packs. All that tire friction has to go somewhere right?

EVs don't burn through tires quickly, they just kept you burn through tires quickly. Tire wear is an extremely strong function of torque. If you accelerate and decelerate calmly then the stiff tires they put on EVs will last a long time. A lot of people drive EVs extremely aggressively because the motor provides a ton of instant torque and they find it fun.

Idk, the thought of 40k miles per tire being the *high end* (maybe my figures are wrong) signals that vehicle weight despite controlled acceleration is the problem

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#780

Post by michaelcampbell »

OptionOfT wrote: post #135
frollogaston wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And manual transmission cars kinda, though the energy is still wasted of course

Depends on how you drive. I never engine braked on my manual. Brakes are easy to replace. Clutches are not.

You engine brake every time you lift off the throttle and don't depress the clutch. I know what you mean here of course, but I suspect your driving habits are saving you less than you think.
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