The United States withdraws from UNESCO • Hacker News Board

Re: The United States withdraws from UNESCO

#511

Post by nonethewiser » Tue, Jul 22, 2025, 4:30 PM UTC

CWuestefeld wrote: post #492

hackyhacky wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The is a good point: the decision was made by Congress, not by Obama. Although I disagree with that decision, that is the correct way to make it. Now, Trump is withdrawing unilaterally, without Congressional approval. Remember when presidents followed the law?

I've been complaining about the increasing power being ceded to the Presidency, like, forever now. This isn't specifically a GOP or DEM thing, it's been happening consistently at least since FDR, and probably even beyond that. That said, the one area where the Constitution really does give the President a fairly free hand is in foreign policy.

And congress increasingly wanting to do nothing.

Re: The United States withdraws from UNESCO

#512

Post by themgt » Tue, Jul 22, 2025, 4:30 PM UTC

dijit wrote: post #360

kennywinker wrote: post #251

The US is complicit in the intentional starvation of gaza’s people by israel. At least 15 people have starved to death in the last 24 hours, including an infant. https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/israel-gaza-war-hunger-childre... Ragequitting UNESCO over their recognition of palestine is a small part of the project of supporting the ethnic cleansing of gaza and the west bank.

Sweden and the US are “kinda cozy” (I would say at least, from an inside perspective on how Sweden seems to lean in to US interests including copyright enforcements and so forth). However Sweden was the first country to recognise Palestine. Is it possible that the pulling out of UNESCO is further in-line with Trumps “we want to focus on America” fluff, similar to the threats of pulling out of NATO and the actual pull…

If you don't believe Gaza's health ministry, how about Agence France-Presse?

The journalists' association of the French wire service Agence France-Presse (AFP) warned on Monday that staff working with the agency in Gaza are at risk of starvation and that "without intervention, the last reporters in Gaza will die."

In the statement, the SDJ said that AFP's journalists in Gaza have warned that they no longer have strength to report, with one photographer, Bashar Taleb, saying in a post on Facebook: "My body is thin and I can no longer work."

"Since AFP was founded in August 1944, we have lost journalists in conflicts, we have had wounded and prisoners in our ranks, but none of us can recall seeing a colleague die of hunger," the SDJ said in a post on X.

https://www.euronews.com/2025/07/22/afp-journalists-at-risk-...

Re: The United States withdraws from UNESCO

#513

Post by throwawaygmbno » Tue, Jul 22, 2025, 4:30 PM UTC

santoshalper wrote: post #474

dijit wrote: post #429

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s really not my fight, I’m Swedish - not American. You’ll always be disappointed if you continue with this mindset though, the world will not bend to you because of your moral outrage, the best you can hope for is to open peoples eyes with understanding - not by calling everyone inhumane, disgusting or laying expectations at their feet.

I think mass murder is one area where we can safely feel moral outrage. It might not work, but it probably has a better chance of influencing the outcome than shrugging and saying "well, that's just how it is".

Kids being murdered is just as awful in Palestine, as it is in Africa, Asia, the Americas or anywhere else in the world. But, at what point does the rest of the world get to run out of "fucks" to give about their conflicts.

I think the US should absolutely stop giving money to Israel, there seems to be no benefit at all and it supports their genocide. But I also see no reason to actually support Palestine. The current conflict can be traced back to the October attacks, but then those attacks can be traced back to some attacks Israel did and back and forth until you get to the Old Testament and probably before that.

It's a religious conflict that won't go away unless you remove religion from it. I don't expect that to happen during my lifetime so I'd rather we just pull the tax dollars out of the region.

Re: The United States withdraws from UNESCO

#514

Post by crote » Tue, Jul 22, 2025, 4:32 PM UTC

redleader55 wrote: post #309

lvl155 wrote: post #40

And it’s wild to think that more than 1/3 of the devs I’ve met in my life support this admin. These are seemingly smart people. The past 10 years or so made me realize I don’t know anything about human nature or intellect. Edit: I am in no way saying conservatism is bad and liberalism is good. I have my values in both.

I think(lol) that assuming the other side stupid is one of the big failures of current political environment. Honestly, I'm baffled that is "ok" to say something like "the other side is stupid" without being called out harshly for it. Using weasel words expressions like "seemingly smart people" doesn't make it better, it makes it worse.

In theory I'd love to agree with you. In practice we are way past that.

I'm totally fine debating whether the sky is blue with someone claiming it's gray because it is usually overcast. I'm happy to entertain the motion that the sky could be bronze - with a reference to ancient Greece and pretty sunsets. At the end of the day we can just agree to disagree and move on.

But I'm not going to debate whether the sky is blue with someone yelling that the sky MUST be green because obviously clouds are green. They have moved so far from the truth that they are either arguing in bad faith or just plain delusional. Neither case is worth even the slightest snippet of my time: I'd have a better chance of success trying to explain my viewpoint to a tree. It isn't politics anymore, it has turned into religion or sports.

Re: The United States withdraws from UNESCO

#515

Post by bm3719 » Tue, Jul 22, 2025, 4:32 PM UTC

tmountain wrote: post #325

fuzzylightbulb wrote: post #9

This administration has zero ability to build or bring people together, able only to destroy what others have made. On the bright side, it isn't effective until December 31, 2026 so there is plenty of time to chicken out.

[flagged]

Hegel, and later Sartre (but from a very different perspective), emphasized the importance of The Other, in the sense of the definition of the Self.

In short, by defining the other, one demarcates the boundary of the self and defines ones identity. Self-identity necessitates the other, in its self-conception and interdependence of the latter's existence. To be reductionist, what does it even mean to be oneself if there is no other?

Re: The United States withdraws from UNESCO

#516

Post by throw310822 » Tue, Jul 22, 2025, 4:32 PM UTC

eapressoandcats wrote: post #464

techright75 wrote: post #382

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Israel doesn’t have a plan to clean up the mess. What is the end goal here? Seriously. They’ve invaded and now what? Options are: 1. Regime change, which I have seen no effort to attempt to effectuate 2. Withdrawal, which seems unlikely at this point. 3. Permanent occupation, which seems like the default. It may end up falling short of full genocide but it’s definitely violently upheld apartheid at a minimum. If the…

Israel's plan is, and has always been, to settle the whole of ethnically cleansed Palestine. Their strategy in Gaza was to promote the mess (propping up Hamas, imposing life conditions calculated to fuel anger, dismissing any long-term truce offer from Hamas) in order to have the excuse to "clean it up". Now they're in the last phase of the clean up, they just have to resist the (weak) indignation of the EU and US leaders.

Re: The United States withdraws from UNESCO

#517

Post by DontchaKnowit » Tue, Jul 22, 2025, 4:33 PM UTC

Pet_Ant wrote: post #495

I feel like the US is becoming like China. Very economically important obviously, but will end up culturally irrelevant. It's hard to build up that much ill-will and still be considered glamorous. I can be wrong, and this isn't my personal judgement, but a genuine prediction.

China is bery culturally relevant and rising. But otherwise yeah I agree with you

Re: The United States withdraws from UNESCO

#518

Post by BigJ1211 » Tue, Jul 22, 2025, 4:33 PM UTC

kennywinker wrote: post #314

crabbone wrote: post #249

This is in response to the flagged comment that, apparently, I cannot comment on. I'm not thrilled about what current US administration is doing when it comes to international NGOs. UNESCO is one example. However, there's also another problem: various UN bodies became tools for international politics instead of doing what they were originally designed to do. It's another example of good will easily subverted by malic…

UNICEF’s mission is “providing humanitarian and developmental aid to children worldwide” Children in gaza are being intentionally starved by israel blocking food aid. At least 15 people including one infant have been starved to death in the past 24 hours. UNESCO’s mission is preservation of cultural heritage. Gaza and the west bank are being ethnically cleansed, and their arts and culture have already been physically…

They've been making that claim since the start of the conflict, including calling it a genocide. There have been an overwhelming amount of articles that later had to be retracted about Israel shooting at aid distribution centers. Not a single video of IDF soldiers shooting at them has been shown.

Unless I get to see actual evidence, I'm not inclined to believe this claim. I see articles report things like: "Since the GHF was launched, Israeli forces have killed more than 400 Palestinians trying to collect food aid, the UN and local doctors say. Israel says the new distribution system stops aid going to Hamas."

And yet there is 0 video evidence of the IDF shooting at them? I don't believe it. There is so much video and pictures floating around social media, yet we don't have any for this claim?

All I can find are articles like this: https://edition.cnn.com/2025/06/04/middleeast/israel-militar.... All you can see is people taking cover by lying prone on the ground.

Or this one by Al Jazeera: https://www.aljazeera.com/video/newsfeed/2025/7/15/video-sho...

Which again shows people prone, bullets shot near them this time.

There's been so much horse-shit and propaganda, I'm not going to believe any claim, unless it is accompanied by direct video evidence.

Re: The United States withdraws from UNESCO

#519

Post by tempnew » Tue, Jul 22, 2025, 4:33 PM UTC

santoshalper wrote: post #474

dijit wrote: post #429

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s really not my fight, I’m Swedish - not American. You’ll always be disappointed if you continue with this mindset though, the world will not bend to you because of your moral outrage, the best you can hope for is to open peoples eyes with understanding - not by calling everyone inhumane, disgusting or laying expectations at their feet.

I think mass murder is one area where we can safely feel moral outrage. It might not work, but it probably has a better chance of influencing the outcome than shrugging and saying "well, that's just how it is".

I felt moral outrage after October 7th, but my moral outrage only served to give Israel a bit more justification for actions which are increasingly and ultimately turning out in a way that provokes similar outrage. Outrage begets outrage, blood will have blood.

Re: The United States withdraws from UNESCO

#520

Post by gizmo686 » Tue, Jul 22, 2025, 4:33 PM UTC

dijit wrote: post #412

kennywinker wrote: post #396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So far all independent verifications of the gaza health ministry’s numbers have found that they under-report the death toll. And i’m not sure how your sweden example says anything about the US supporting israel’s genocide? Was there something you expected to happen when sweden recognized palestine?

Really? Every time I search for independent verification I am told it’s too hard to come up with anything conclusive.

Multiple things can be true at once.

It is hard/impossible to come up with an accurate death toll.

The Gaza Health Ministry systemically underreports the death toll by only counting bodies that they have directly observed.

Some third parties have tried to extrapolate from the reported numbers to get to the actual numbers; but that is a highly speculative endeavor under the best circumstances.