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Linux Reaches 5% Desktop Market Share in USA

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Re: Linux Reaches 5% Desktop Market Share in USA

#531

Post by bichiliad »

arp242 wrote: post #92
jsnell wrote: post #18

The statscounter data is not reliable, and it is just embarrassing how often these posts make it to the HN frontpage. You even have a demonstration in this very article, with the surge of classic Mac OS to 7% for several months . The data is obviously nonsense, and when it has errors nobody at the company cares about them. But when they have persistent "data reporting issues", why are we supposed to believe any of th…

> the surge of classic Mac OS to 7% for several months I'm not sure what's up with listing both "OS X" and "macOS", but I'm quite confident it's not classic Mac OS.

This could be related to the re-versioning of macOS from 10.x to the year of the release.

Re: Linux Reaches 5% Desktop Market Share in USA

#532

Post by akho »

Pxtl wrote: post #517
akho wrote: post #473

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You installed a distro that aims to preserve suckage for future generations, and even developed an entire DE out of pure aversion to change. It’s often recommended by change-averse Linux users… Successful Linux-based OSes have unattended atomic updates and user-friendly app installation. That includes ChromeOs and Android, as well as modern atomic desktop distributions. Fedora Silverblue, Bluefin, Bazzite. edit: howe…

Ah, I had no idea Mint Cinnamon was about "preserving suckage". I remember when Mint launched it was all about "Ubuntu but easier, like non-free stuff included" and my understanding was Cinnamon was their own DE built to follow familiar UI patterns and customizability instead of Gnome's opinionated stuff. Didn't realize that it was also for grumps who wanted bug-compatibility in their workflow.

Mint, afaik, offers a choice between Cinnamon, MATE, and Xfce. These are all DEs built and maintained to preserve a particular workflow based around hierarchical “start” menus, menu bars in applications, and desktop icons — the Win’95 style. This particular selection is very indicative of a preference for a particular era.

Which is fine if that’s your preference, too. However, you shouldn’t expect your experience to be significantly different from what it was when that desktop experience was fresh when you choose a product made by people with such strong preferences.

Again, Bluefin and the like update (atomically, with a rollback option) when you turn your computer off, with no interruptions or sudoing; app installs are through Gnome Software (for GUI stuff; through brew otherwise), without a need to enter passwords. You pay for that with some customizability, but it’s rock solid if it works on your hardware.

Re: Linux Reaches 5% Desktop Market Share in USA

#533

Post by pndy »

dmantis wrote: post #125
koakuma-chan wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not use Win 11?

1. Ads 2. Built-in cloud AI spyware / Copilot 3. Millions of abandoned laptops that had been made 4-5+ years ago. Basically electronic and ecological waste: machines from 10 years ago work perfectly fine if you change thermal paste and don't hit them too much. Even if you don't care about the planet, you might care about your wallet though.

3 is especially ironic with that green leaf and energy recommendations slapped in settings

Re: Linux Reaches 5% Desktop Market Share in USA

#534

Post by pndy »

CuriouslyC wrote: post #121
bboygravity wrote: post #37

Is this because Linux became so good or because Windows 11 is so terrible? I guess a bit of both.

Pretty sure it's because Windows has gotten worse. I ditched windows recently because it was flagging bit torrent software as malware and deleting it (utorrent, qbittorrent, deluge, all directly from official sources), and when I tried to turn the setting off in the control panel it wouldn't allow me to. A few minutes later it popped up an advertising notification for a F2P windows store game. Linux hasn't necessaril…

> I ditched windows recently because it was flagging bit torrent software as malware and deleting it

W10 once removed CCleaner from my system because it was an older version. I kept it that way because it was the last version at the time that didn't come with telemetry.

Re: Linux Reaches 5% Desktop Market Share in USA

#535

Post by return_to_monke »

udev4096 wrote: post #436
conradev wrote: post #387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, and in the reverse, you don't need a separate kernel to run Android software on Linux: https://waydro.id

Waydroid is garbage. It's so bad. Better use redroid: https://github.com/remote-android/redroid-doc

You failed to provide any reason why waydroid is "so bad".

Re: Linux Reaches 5% Desktop Market Share in USA

#536

Post by Melatonic »

nerdjon wrote: post #53

I have to wonder how much of this is people switching to Linux vs the larger trend of people not having traditional computers to begin with. Outside of gamers, I don't know anyone that has a computer at home that is not their work laptop if they have one. At least in my circle everyone I know has moved to their general computing being on phones and tablets which is not captured here. So is a solid chunk of this the p…

I think this is probably it. That plus the SteamDeck and maybe other random linux running devices.

Re: Linux Reaches 5% Desktop Market Share in USA

#537

Post by rstuart4133 »

dartharva wrote: post #361
palata wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with your points, except this: > thanks to the Steam Deck [...] but I would be reluctant to call that Linux Desktop anymore than I would call Android an uptick for Linux. The Steam Deck very much runs Linux Desktop. Android runs the Linux kernel, but everything else is different. SteamOS is a Linux distribution based on Arch. If you run your Steam Deck in "desktop mode", it is very much a Linux Desktop (with…

What even is "Linux Desktop" and why does Android not qualify as one? Many Android tablets (especially those with Samsung Dex) can certainly double up as desktops if its users were so willing, at least a lot more so than the Steam Deck.

> What even is "Linux Desktop" and why does Android not qualify as one?

A desktop is a computer that sits on your desk, as opposed to being held in your hand. In concrete terms, you can install Android Firefox on ChromeOS, and it runs fine. But it is near unusable because it turns out how people interact with desktops is very different to how people interact with phones.

Also, desktop window managers tend to look like a protocol, rather than a library. That because every language can speak a protocol, but a library is written in one language and if you are lucky, someone many have provided bindings to that library to the language you are using.

Android's display is effectively a Java library. If you want to talk to it from C or Python, you have to FFI to Java, which sucks from a number of perspectives. It's not how you would implement a general purpose desktop environment, and I've never met anyone who considers it to be one.

That lack of flexibility shows up in a number of other ways. For example it's not difficult to implement an phone OS interface using XWindows or Wayland. Neither particularly care what window manager is running on top of them them. The reverse isn't true. You can't provide a the multi-window desktop environment on Android as it stands.

None of this is true for ChromeOS. It uses Wayland under the hood, and so you can install and run Debian GUI apps on it. In fact I do that, and it mostly works as you would expect. Thus I consider ChromeOS to be true Linux Desktop environment, and it should be counted as one. It isn't mind you - but I think should be.

Google seems to be in the process of replacing ChromeOS with Android, and as part of that process ChromeOS's ability to run Linux desktop apps is being ported to Android. If and when that happens, then I'd consider Android to be Linux desktop too.

Re: Linux Reaches 5% Desktop Market Share in USA

#538

Post by IsTom »

MostlyStable wrote: post #389
samrus wrote: post #353

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is wrong. A steamdeck in desktop mode is exactly a desktop. You can write and execute code on it the exact same way you do on your laptop You cant do that on mobile devices or other handhelds

Yes, you can, and yes, among the group of people represented on HN, I have no doubt that a fair number do use it this way.....but how typical is that? How often does the average steam deck owner use it as a desktop? How often does the average user leave the steam launcher? How often does the average user think of it as anything other than a gaming console? If all you care about is some very technical sense of "how ma…

You need to switch to desktop mode to install non-steam software like emulators, so I assume some people use it at least intermittently. And I've seen some posts about people running a DAW (bitwig) on it. It's not going to be many people, but the deck is a legit linux PC if you've got a dock with peripherials attached. Can't say that about other consoles.

Re: Linux Reaches 5% Desktop Market Share in USA

#539

Post by pms »

nerdjon wrote: post #53

I have to wonder how much of this is people switching to Linux vs the larger trend of people not having traditional computers to begin with. Outside of gamers, I don't know anyone that has a computer at home that is not their work laptop if they have one. At least in my circle everyone I know has moved to their general computing being on phones and tablets which is not captured here. So is a solid chunk of this the p…

Why is this is a top comment? Market share is a relative measure. Even if there is a drop in the number of personal computers, still it's an achievement that the drop didn't affect Linux, while it affected other platforms.

> Basically if the higher percent is due to less desktops overall instead of a major uptick in Linux desktops, it is not really much to celebrate.

I disagree. Imagine that Linux became the OS used on 95% of personal computers. According to your reasoning there wouldn't be much to celebrate. Says who?

Re: Linux Reaches 5% Desktop Market Share in USA

#540

Post by Forgeties79 »

jorvi wrote: post #352
palata wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with your points, except this: > thanks to the Steam Deck [...] but I would be reluctant to call that Linux Desktop anymore than I would call Android an uptick for Linux. The Steam Deck very much runs Linux Desktop. Android runs the Linux kernel, but everything else is different. SteamOS is a Linux distribution based on Arch. If you run your Steam Deck in "desktop mode", it is very much a Linux Desktop (with…

You are being obtuse. 99% of Steam Deck users won't ever use the desktop mode except for maybe setting up emulation or Discord. In general, that makes Steam Deck users no more Linux users than people that use Android.

You would be correct if steam deck users were in line with the average computer user, but they definitely skew more towards the tech savvy crowd - the crowd that would be interested in desktop/emulation.

Part of this is in order to use a steam deck, unless you want to be very limited, you kind of have to be a little more tech savvy. I love my deck, but it is definitely not plug and play/turn key like a switch is for instance. Hell until a year or so ago swapping between gaming and desktop mode resulted in a total crash like 30% of the time. It still doesn’t dock and undock seamlessly, you get all kinds of wild behavior with standard TVs still, and if you’re off your home network and it tries to update it can still lock you out. It’s not as bad as it used to be, but it’s still a distinct possibility.

I love it and frankly the machine is a marvel, especially at its price point. But I still struggle to recommend it to people.

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