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Apple just released a weirdly interesting coding language model

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Re: Apple just released a weirdly interesting coding language model

#61

Post by overfeed »

iwontberude wrote: post #6
vessenes wrote: post #4

Short version: A Qwen-2.5 7b model that has been turned into a diffusion model. A couple notable things: first is that you can do this at all, (left to right model -> out of order diffusion via finetuning) which is really interesting. Second, the final version beats original by a small margin on some benchmarks. Third is that it’s in the ballpark of Gemini diffusion, although not competitive — to be expected for any…

I think Apple will ultimately destroy the data center, I hope they succeed.

> I think Apple will ultimately destroy the data center

I think EVs destroying Ultra Large Container ships had better odds, amd both are extremely unlikely. Dc advantages Apple won't be able to overcome: compute density, cooling, cheap power, physical security to protect the software, scale + bandwidth, lower costs to customers of using contract manufacturers and/or commodity hardware.

There is no universe where large enterprises ditch their geo-located racks. Let alone hyperscalers, especially now that they are scrounging for energy, reneging on pledges on renewables, and paying bug bucks to bring nuclear power stations online

Re: Apple just released a weirdly interesting coding language model

#62

Post by lxgr »

hnaccount_rng wrote: post #52
lxgr wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How many people own a NAS, but not a PC or Mac? That’s arguably the wrong question: I bet a lot more would own one if they could easily backup their iOS devices to it.

The number of people that would but a NAS over just spending the 5$/month for storage is well below a percent and if you combine that with the requirement of not having a PC/Mac you may well end up in the hundreds… There aren’t that many people that are willing to own a device from a company but not trusting that company with their data

Your numbers might be right, but Apple has implemented niche features, some even requiring expensive per-device hardware, for much less than that.

Re: Apple just released a weirdly interesting coding language model

#63

Post by hnaccount_rng »

lxgr wrote: post #62
hnaccount_rng wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The number of people that would but a NAS over just spending the 5$/month for storage is well below a percent and if you combine that with the requirement of not having a PC/Mac you may well end up in the hundreds… There aren’t that many people that are willing to own a device from a company but not trusting that company with their data

Your numbers might be right, but Apple has implemented niche features, some even requiring expensive per-device hardware, for much less than that.

Do you have an example?

Re: Apple just released a weirdly interesting coding language model

#64

Post by hnaccount_rng »

Ldorigo wrote: post #57
hnaccount_rng wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But if the limiting factor is the data on which the models are trained and not the actual “computation” than this would be exactly expected right?

The data might be the limiting factor of current transformer architectures, but there's no reason to believe it's a general limiting factor of any language model (e.g. humans brains are "trained" on orders of magnitude less data and still generally perform better than any model available today)

That depends on whether these current learning models can really generalise or whether they can only interpolate within their training set

Re: Apple just released a weirdly interesting coding language model

#65

Post by layer8 »

lokar wrote: post #60
dboreham wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's delusional to think that most software projects can be planned in advance beyond "there will be a beginning, a middle, and an end". People do it, but their efforts are in my experience generally ignored once implementation get underway.

That’s true at the project level. But surely when you sit down to actually work for a couple hours you think about what you are going to do, and then mostly do that.

In my experience it’s more fractal. Any subgoal, however small, may run into its own planning/thinking and then doing sequence, or even have you reconsider the higher-level plan. Of course, it somewhat depends on how run-of-the-mill the overall task is.

Re: Apple just released a weirdly interesting coding language model

#66

Post by wellthisisgreat »

Incipient wrote: post #40

The model itself I'm actually less fussed about. The integration with the ide and the ability to easily get the model the right context is what I struggle with (vscode is passable with the recent 101 update). I find pretty much all models in copilot offer similar-ish performance. I've been looking for good/best-practice workflow setups to work with docker python/fastapi backends and vue frontends...but I haven't foun…

I tried every single frontier model for code-related tasks and Claude Code is the best by a margin.

Other, non-programming-related tasks are a different story though

Re: Apple just released a weirdly interesting coding language model

#67

Post by lxgr »

hnaccount_rng wrote: post #63
lxgr wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your numbers might be right, but Apple has implemented niche features, some even requiring expensive per-device hardware, for much less than that.

Do you have an example?

All new iPhone models support native DisplayPort output via USB-C, yet I’m not sure 1% of users even have the required cable/adapter.

Some of the power amplifiers for rarely-used bands probably qualify as well (mmWave in particular).

On the software side I’d have to dig a bit, but I bet many code paths on iOS see use of less than 1% of all users.

Re: Apple just released a weirdly interesting coding language model

#68

Post by Eggpants »

koakuma-chan wrote: post #17
vessenes wrote: post #4

Short version: A Qwen-2.5 7b model that has been turned into a diffusion model. A couple notable things: first is that you can do this at all, (left to right model -> out of order diffusion via finetuning) which is really interesting. Second, the final version beats original by a small margin on some benchmarks. Third is that it’s in the ballpark of Gemini diffusion, although not competitive — to be expected for any…

> At some point these local models will get good enough for ‘real work’ Are these small models good enough for anything but autocomplete?

Most of the "magic" of large models are really just function calls, so as long as the small models have access to the same functions they work well. They fixed the "how many R's in Strawberry" issue by offloading the question to a function, not spending a godly amount of money/energy on training another model.

Oops, sorry "Tools". Gotta maintain the grift these statistic based lossy text compression cool bar tricks are "thinking".

Re: Apple just released a weirdly interesting coding language model

#69

Post by sitkack »

roughly wrote: post #59
vessenes wrote: post #4

Short version: A Qwen-2.5 7b model that has been turned into a diffusion model. A couple notable things: first is that you can do this at all, (left to right model -> out of order diffusion via finetuning) which is really interesting. Second, the final version beats original by a small margin on some benchmarks. Third is that it’s in the ballpark of Gemini diffusion, although not competitive — to be expected for any…

> A diffusion model comes with a lot of benefits in terms of parallelization and therefore speed; to my mind the architecture is a better fit for coding than strict left to right generation. I had a similar notion and am excited to see this research being done. My experience of writing code is that the structure of the whole system influences each individual part, which has always felt like a better match for a diffu…

The "no moat" memo is way more complex than Google admitting an uncomfortable truth. The benefit massively from having seemingly internal documents leaked about how the play field is fair.

Re: Apple just released a weirdly interesting coding language model

#70

Post by infecto »

crappybird wrote: post #29
infecto wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is any of the Jetbrains offerings even competitive. I jumped shipped from Pycharm and have tried their AI offerings a few times since release but was always wildly impressed at how far behind they were of the competition.

Junie is so amazing. It burns through credits like hellfire, but I have only seen claude-code and opencode coming anywhere close to it. Did you use the normal Jetbrains AI assistant, or was it junie?

Thanks for the recommendation. Pretty sure this was all pre Junie so will need to try it again.
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