The Worst Argument In The World (lesswrong.com)
http://lesswrong.com/lw/e95/the_worst_argument_in_the_world/
Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
21–30 of 107 posts
Re: Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
#22Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm actually quite fed up with people portraying India negatively. Oprah Winfrey has done this and I am surprised at how this seems to be the consensus with the media. Yes India has some issues with policy and infrastructure, however they are trying to sort this problem out. Have you heard of the 4g network that's a work in progress? If you actually read the article you would know that non Indian wrote it. "It’s a po…
> the owners of the internet café also has to keep a record of all sites visited Sorry, but that is just not true.
Ok maybe not all site but they are encourage to snoop
http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/new...
bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-18434112
Re: Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
#23I am not sure if India is a police state yet or not. I think tourists don't have it easy as they don't understand the country as well as the natives. If you are a native you do know how to get things done. However, it is true that India is on the slippery slope where its most important democratic institutions are slowly breaking down. The first to go was the media, an example of which was the media now running paid c…
True. The recent media coverage of the recent riots and migration was distressing, marking yet another nadir in their slide downwards. I got better reports from following leads on reddit and forums than I did from looking at the media. At first I didn't give credence to what people said about the media being mouth pieces for various parties. Now I wouldn't trust them if they told me the earth was round. The judiciary…
I think Manmohan Singh gets far too much credit for the reforms. Those who have studied Indian Economics will know that liberalization was forced on us. We were close to bankruptcy in 1991 and the IMF forced the reforms on us in exchange for a bailout. Unfortunately, having branded him as an architect of our reforms, we have also set our expectations very high.
Re: Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
#24Earlier quoted context omitted.
> If you actually read the article you would know that non Indian wrote it. Dead wrong. Jawed Anwar wrote it, a ToI columnist. He just quoted Soghoian's tweet and used that as linkbait. I posted this article on HN, without the question mark as heading, because this is one headline where Betteridge's law would not apply.
im referring to Soghoian
You'd still be wrong. Soghoian's "contribution" to the article is just his tweet cited by the actual author and nothing more.
Re: Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
#25Your police aren't given $100 Million from taxpayers to buy toys like this, including land and air drones.
http://www.theatlanticwire.com/national/2012/08/hardcore-sec...
I think US has India and virtually all other countries beat.
I expect they are going to start to do random stops for IRIS scans like they do in the middle-east over here soon - you know, for all the terrorists roaming our streets and airports and buses and trains.
Re: Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
#26Your police aren't given $100 Million from taxpayers to buy toys like this, including land and air drones. http://www.theatlanticwire.com/national/2012/08/hardcore-sec... I think US has India and virtually all other countries beat. I expect they are going to start to do random stops for IRIS scans like they do in the middle-east over here soon - you know, for all the terrorists roaming our streets and airports and bu…
Huh? This article says that in India, the police have required store owners to collect ID before allowing people to use the Internet, have required hotel owners to deny rooms to people from Delhi, require police verification before you can rent an apartment, and require witness statements to open a bank account.
And so you have one article suggesting that the police somewhere wasted money on an APC, and now "we have them beat"?
What kind of argument is that?
Re: Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
#27I would disagree. India is not a police state. India is a bureaucratic state. These regulations are not meant to frighten or intimidate people. As the article points out, they're so ineffectual as to be laughable. Police states tend to be quite a bit more brutal than that.
No, all of these regulations, permits and rules are classic hallmark of bureaucratic empire building. All those Internet cafés now need to be inspected to ensure that they're keeping track of their customers. The department that manages to grab that privilege has access to more lobbying power, more bribes, and more influence. Any politician would lust after side-benefits like that. So, after any catastrophe, the answer is always more regulations and more inspections, regardless of whether those regulations and inspections would do anything to actually solve the problem.
Re: Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
#28My experiences are unlike the blog says. You've got to know your city and where the services, things are not that organized ofcourse. Also, India is big on Human powered telephony search query based services(see 1). It really really works here. For example, you could ask who runs the nearest color copier via phone, and the answer would be SMSed to you. Also another thing which is unique in India, is the home delivery…
>Need a new credit card, or a phone connection ? You can have a representative visit you. These kinda of services are primarily possible to India's abundance human resource (and various other factors of course).
Of course, you have to ask why it's often necessary for someone to provide those services. The answer is that oftentimes India's infrastructure is so rickety, it's easier for the corporation to maintain a private courier pool than it is for them to trust the postal service or a private delivery service.
Re: Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
#29A few years ago I had traveled to India, and had plans to leave the country for a week then return.
Big mistake.
I was advised to go to the Indian embassy in the destination country to get permission to come back. I did so, they took my passport and told me to come back the following day, hence delaying my travels within that country by a day. I returned to India ok. When i was leaving India I was asked why I had not checked in with the local police after returning. This was confusing to me but this said its a requirement for any foreigner leaving and returning within a 2 month period. As such, they wouldn't let me board the plane. I stayed in a hotel near the airport thru the weekend. On a Monday I went to the appropriate station, where there was a long line of foreigners in a similar predicament. When it was my turn, I was told i would need to show proof of a relative or someone I was staying with, so my uncle came and brought his passport and electric bill. Then I was told it would take some time, but he went in the back, met the director of that station and talked him up by mentioning people they knew in common and I got approved.
Then there were no seats on my plane available for the rest of the week, but I had to get back to work, so I bought a new ticket and went home.
I am Indian mind you, although born and raised in the US.
I will not be returning to India ever again.
Re: Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
#30Great website.. As soon as I open it a javascript popup shows saying "ReferenceError: FB not defined".