My experiences are unlike the blog says. You've got to know your city and where the services, things are not that organized ofcourse. Also, India is big on Human powered telephony search query based services(see 1). It really really works here. For example, you could ask who runs the nearest color copier via phone, and the answer would be SMSed to you. Also another thing which is unique in India, is the home delivery…
Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
11–20 of 107 posts
Re: Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
#12Re: Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
#13Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is a wrong way to reason about it. The article appears in an Indian paper, why single out U.S. as the country to compare to? Also, just because other countries have other restrictions (wrong or otherwise), that doesn't justify such restrictions in India. P.S. Avoid typing in all caps. It comes off as rude.
I'm actually quite fed up with people portraying India negatively. Oprah Winfrey has done this and I am surprised at how this seems to be the consensus with the media. Yes India has some issues with policy and infrastructure, however they are trying to sort this problem out. Have you heard of the 4g network that's a work in progress? If you actually read the article you would know that non Indian wrote it. "It’s a po…
Dead wrong. Jawed Anwar wrote it, a ToI columnist. He just quoted Soghoian's tweet and used that as linkbait. I posted this article on HN, without the question mark as heading, because this is one headline where Betteridge's law would not apply.
Re: Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
#14Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is a wrong way to reason about it. The article appears in an Indian paper, why single out U.S. as the country to compare to? Also, just because other countries have other restrictions (wrong or otherwise), that doesn't justify such restrictions in India. P.S. Avoid typing in all caps. It comes off as rude.
I'm actually quite fed up with people portraying India negatively. Oprah Winfrey has done this and I am surprised at how this seems to be the consensus with the media. Yes India has some issues with policy and infrastructure, however they are trying to sort this problem out. Have you heard of the 4g network that's a work in progress? If you actually read the article you would know that non Indian wrote it. "It’s a po…
Sorry, but that is just not true.
Re: Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
#15> No Public Wi-Fi : Several restaurants in Delhi/NCR have free WiFi, sure you probably need to buy a coffee or something, but that's hardly an expense. You won't find a public open WiFi when walking down the road, because most WiFi networks here are private networks and the their owners have opted to secure them.
> Cyber Cafes require passport - They need any ID proof. DL/PAN Card/Passport/Ration Card/Student ID (virtually anything goes) and they need a copy for their records. If you checked into any hotel in India or abroad, they do the same, I don't see him complaining about that. No Cyber cafes will insist for just DL / Passport, if they do, simply walk to the next one, they have a lot of competition.
> FIR required to get a new SIM - Not any more, I got a replacement SIM without requiring to submit a FIR for my lost phone. He skipped to mention his cell phone operator.
> Color Photocopies issues - If you get a color photocopy of a ID or a mark sheet, they simply stamp a small message in a corner "COLOR PHOTOCOPY, NOT ORIGINAL" or something to that effect. I find this practice perfectly reasonable.
> Courier DHL / Bluedart - Some courier companies are finicky about sending certain items not because of "security" concerns, but they prefer to avoid food items or glass containers. The solution is to simply walk to the next courier service. Again, the competition is quite high in this sector, and DHL and Bluedart can get away with this behavior, however that's where smaller courier services step in.
> Tenant verification - Yes, the tenants need to be verified, but it is not strictly implemented. Breaking news: Yes, the police officers can act like assholes sometimes, and talking about his colleague in a relatively isolated incident is a good way to prove his suspicions!
> Bank Accounts - The "vouching" system is a decades old tradition when the banking system in India was membership based. It is no longer the case even in most public sector banks, and no private sector banks implement that.
> Proof of residence - There are several alternate proof of residence which a citizen can furnish (and are widely accepted) : LPG Connection Bill, Electricity Bill, Voter ID, Passport etc. Take your pick. A legal resident in India will have atleast 1 of these, if not more.
Ultimately I find the author biased and and focusing on the border-line cases in each scenario. Its ludicrous to believe that he faced these issues everyday he left his home.
Re: Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
#16we are turning into communist nut-jobs. Thanks to the gandhi family and congress. gandhi family were lead in forming the congress party which was formed under british rule to support british indra gandhi declared an emergency and edited the constituent of india(made us socialist) *gandhi brought u features like no more than 20 SMS per mobile no more cars below 16 liter/KM average 10^32 scams a shitty budget that give…
Citation, please!
Re: Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
#17My experiences are unlike the blog says. You've got to know your city and where the services, things are not that organized ofcourse. Also, India is big on Human powered telephony search query based services(see 1). It really really works here. For example, you could ask who runs the nearest color copier via phone, and the answer would be SMSed to you. Also another thing which is unique in India, is the home delivery…
Re: Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
#18Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm actually quite fed up with people portraying India negatively. Oprah Winfrey has done this and I am surprised at how this seems to be the consensus with the media. Yes India has some issues with policy and infrastructure, however they are trying to sort this problem out. Have you heard of the 4g network that's a work in progress? If you actually read the article you would know that non Indian wrote it. "It’s a po…
> If you actually read the article you would know that non Indian wrote it. Dead wrong. Jawed Anwar wrote it, a ToI columnist. He just quoted Soghoian's tweet and used that as linkbait. I posted this article on HN, without the question mark as heading, because this is one headline where Betteridge's law would not apply.
Re: Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
#19My experiences are unlike the blog says. You've got to know your city and where the services, things are not that organized ofcourse. Also, India is big on Human powered telephony search query based services(see 1). It really really works here. For example, you could ask who runs the nearest color copier via phone, and the answer would be SMSed to you. Also another thing which is unique in India, is the home delivery…
It IS absurd:
That in a country which is implementing a Universal Identity system for all its citizens, It wants to track:
1) Where and when you use public wifi
2) Where and when you stay at a hotel
3) Where when and what you send in parcels (all countries prevent sending illegal goods)
4) when you apply for gas
5) apply for a mobile phone
and on.
Words cannot express my bewilderment when otherwise intelligent people argue that this is for the benefit for our country.
India's solution to solving problems is to assume that its citizens are criminals, and that more monitoring will help. And the citizens response is to accuse the government of being criminals.
At the same time it doesn't detract from:
1) Great strides and innovation in mobile value added services. Forget SMSes, or calling up toll free numbers for information. You can give a missed call to some numbers and companies will call you back. That blew my mind when you consider the cost is 0.
2) Lots of human advantages as mentioned, delivery systems to your doorstep.
Both co-exist. Yet explaining one doesn't detract from the other.
And of the examples mentioned, the constant growth of India as a police state IS far more important than highlighting the positives of the country.
Re: Yes, India is a police state - Christopher Soghoian
#20I am not sure if India is a police state yet or not. I think tourists don't have it easy as they don't understand the country as well as the natives. If you are a native you do know how to get things done. However, it is true that India is on the slippery slope where its most important democratic institutions are slowly breaking down. The first to go was the media, an example of which was the media now running paid c…
The recent media coverage of the recent riots and migration was distressing, marking yet another nadir in their slide downwards.
I got better reports from following leads on reddit and forums than I did from looking at the media.
At first I didn't give credence to what people said about the media being mouth pieces for various parties. Now I wouldn't trust them if they told me the earth was round.
The judiciary is doing a better job, but are constantly having to encroach on duties supposed to be carried out by the government.
Take the idea of Public Interest Litigations which were propounded by a Chief Justice. They in turn became a corner stone of the fight against corruption. Allowing people to take up injustices so that the common good can be defended.
Fortunately the election commission found its teeth a while back and fought hard against to bring us fair elections. Unfortunately there were some signs of push back against the EC recently, so the next wave is underway by the looks of things.
Similarly the government is headed by what should be the most progressive of leaders, the man who helped create the 1991 liberalization reforms.
Yet it is constantly hamstrung by its own politics to increase its power, and at the mercy of pro communist, anti market, and anti progress swing parties.
The middle class WAS concerned recently with the Anna Hazare campaigns to push for an anti corruption ombudsman.
That was frightening to an extent for the government because they had a vote bank which was apathetic suddenly show signs of life.
The subsequent destruction and implosion of the organizers of the anti corruption drive, have now left the middle class in a stage between waking and sleeping.