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National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

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Re: National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

#51

Post by WarOnPrivacy »

cogman10 wrote: post #37
efitz wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Until some random crazy person exercises the same right and destroys an irreplaceable rare book. You have to get a library card for the library. I don’t see why there is so much outrage over this, and I think the timing is more about budget cuts than about Trump [caveat- firing the archivist might have been personal]. I find the arguments that “he just wants to sow distrust” etc. are completely unbelievable; he has b…

> You have to get a library card for the library. I don’t see why there is so much outrage over this Why do they need a "legitimate business need" to access the material? Why aren't they instead requiring a simple library card and/or identification. That's why people are upset. This is more than just requiring a library card. > Until some random crazy person exercises the same right and destroys an irreplaceable rare…

> Every library I've been in with rare books requires supervision by the archivist if you want to browse them. Sometimes only the archivist can handle the book.

Sure. The LOC librarians never seemed to be out of sight from 8yo me. And they were always happy to get what I asked for. It was a reasonable, functional arrangement.

Re: National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

#53

Post by ggm »

cogman10 wrote: post #42
pwinkeler wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why surprised? Didn't US taxpayers pay for the collection of all this information? Now only those with "legitimate" interest can get access? I would very much like to know what the reasoning behind this move is. Although I suspect that as per usual, a reason will not be forthcoming. But who knows, perhaps the Epstein files are now being kept there, LOL?

I dislike the fact that people are so hostile to the idea of public goods/services/places. It's really sad that free access to information is something anyone would find crazy or objectionable.

Overloading of the word "free" here. Contextually you might be meaning anonymous, unannounced, no justification required. Only anonimity would be harmed by requiring ID and in the case of at risk manuscripts, one of a kind, holograph works of significant value, I could see reasons to say "we have a booking system"

are you being reductionist on this, and "demanding" that unconstrained access exist as a norm?

I don't find identified purposeful access objectionable. I am concerned at the amount of degredation to works from constant public access to them: its a thing in european museums, cultural exhibits, lasceaux..

Re: National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

#54

Post by cortesoft »

efitz wrote: post #33
WarOnPrivacy wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> in the UK some institutions like the national library of scotland are so-called "copyright libraries" and they have always restricted access to people who register and declare an interest grounded in research As an 8yo, I'd walk into the US Library of Congress alone and ask for rare books. I like this way best.

Until some random crazy person exercises the same right and destroys an irreplaceable rare book. You have to get a library card for the library. I don’t see why there is so much outrage over this, and I think the timing is more about budget cuts than about Trump [caveat- firing the archivist might have been personal]. I find the arguments that “he just wants to sow distrust” etc. are completely unbelievable; he has b…

> You have to get a library card for the library

No you don't. You only need a library card if you want to bring a book home. Anyone can read at the library.

Re: National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

#55

Post by Cheer2171 »

gardnr wrote: post #29

Looks like NARA are underfunded [1] and trying to grapple with how to prioritize digital transformation while still meeting KTLO demands. They closed three facilities last year. [2] The goal was/is to digitize everything to increase access to the archives for everyone. The current administration reduced NARA funding and, in February, dismissed Shogan as "Archivist of the United States" but it appears a plan for a str…

> KTLO

Keep The Lights On?

Re: National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

#56

Post by mandevil »

almosthere wrote: post #52

It's comical to me that anyone is complaining here because a) everyone with a business purpose are the only ones going. b) NO one on hacker news is ever going to go.

Proof by counter example: I've been to NARA II at College Park dozens of times, researching and writing various papers or games I have worked on as side projects. So for example I did a lot of research on WW2 era naval damage control for a video game I was working on that never actually got out of the prototype stage.

Depending on exactly how this is enforced it could be nothing or could be a big deal. It depends entirely on how much you trust the people who will be setting and enforcing the policies, and right now there have been a lot of withdrawals and very few deposits into the organizational trust of the US Government supply.

Re: National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

#57

Post by londons_explore »

Molitor5901 wrote: post #46

I have a researcher card, it's not an arduous process. The staff are very kind. When you show up to the National Archives in Washington, DC., prepare to encounter a general group of 2 dozen pros carrying scanners, laptops, etc. It's quite the experience. I don't see this is that big of a deal. It's open, you can access it, but they are controlling more. Given the propensity for the theft and destruction of archives d…

I want more lockdown of the original documents (put them in a cave somewhere), but more openness of digital scans.

Please just make a huge torrent and let everyone take a look.

Re: National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

#58

Post by yieldcrv »

cogman10 wrote: post #42
pwinkeler wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why surprised? Didn't US taxpayers pay for the collection of all this information? Now only those with "legitimate" interest can get access? I would very much like to know what the reasoning behind this move is. Although I suspect that as per usual, a reason will not be forthcoming. But who knows, perhaps the Epstein files are now being kept there, LOL?

I dislike the fact that people are so hostile to the idea of public goods/services/places. It's really sad that free access to information is something anyone would find crazy or objectionable.

I dislike it when all the normal, common, things this administration does is masqueraded as an egregious affront to freedoms and democracy

When the same energy should have either been applied to all the other administrations

Or only focus on the things that actually are unique

Re: National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

#59

Post by MichaelZuo »

Molitor5901 wrote: post #46

I have a researcher card, it's not an arduous process. The staff are very kind. When you show up to the National Archives in Washington, DC., prepare to encounter a general group of 2 dozen pros carrying scanners, laptops, etc. It's quite the experience. I don't see this is that big of a deal. It's open, you can access it, but they are controlling more. Given the propensity for the theft and destruction of archives d…

Do they actually bring out unique archival records for the general public?

I thought it was always backed up stuff.

If not, even assuming a 0.1% rate of scroundels over time that must mean thousands of records have been destroyed or stolen or tampered with…

Re: National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

#60

Post by cogman10 »

ggm wrote: post #53
cogman10 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dislike the fact that people are so hostile to the idea of public goods/services/places. It's really sad that free access to information is something anyone would find crazy or objectionable.

Overloading of the word "free" here. Contextually you might be meaning anonymous, unannounced, no justification required. Only anonimity would be harmed by requiring ID and in the case of at risk manuscripts, one of a kind, holograph works of significant value, I could see reasons to say "we have a booking system" are you being reductionist on this, and "demanding" that unconstrained access exist as a norm? I don't f…

> no justification required

That is the main thing I mean by free.

I agree, requiring ID and even appointments is something that isn't objectionable. The issue I have is requiring a justification. Who approves or dismisses justifications? What's considered an invalid justification?

Unconstrained access isn't what I'm talking about, unjustified access is.

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