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Apple Wins Patent Ruling As Jury Finds Samsung Infringes

techcrunch.com

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Re: Apple Wins Patent Ruling As Jury Finds Samsung Infringes

#181

Post by mbreese »

notatoad wrote: post #172
barista wrote: post #5

It feels good when the judgments reflect what is a common sense to a reasonable person. Glad the common sense prevailed here. It was obvious that the android devices were copied from iPhones.

It was obvious that samsung tried to make their devices look and feel like apple devices. what isn't obvious is why apple should have exclusive ownership over things making a stretching gesture with your fingers to make something bigger. not only were they not the first to implement it, it is entirely a natural movement and is not something that should be anybody's property.

Yeah, because I do that all the time to my newspaper to see the small print. It's a natural movement now, but in 2006, not so much.

Re: Apple Wins Patent Ruling As Jury Finds Samsung Infringes

#182

Post by jellicle »

nirvana wrote: post #168
magicalist wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does anyone know why Jeff Han's work was not emphasized more as prior art? (there was also more at the time, but I can't recall specifics now). > If we had patents on desktop GUI user input standards like right click, ctrl key modifiers like ctrl-scroll to zoom, etc. then using computers would be a much bigger PITA. This is the key right here. I don't think everyone fully understands what is happening around these UI…

There is a big misunderstanding of patents. Patents don't cover ideas, but inventions. "Pinch to zoom" is a feature, and the idea of doing that is not patentable by Apple or Jeff Han. It is the implementation that is patentable, and Apple's touch technology is very different from Jeff Hans'. It's quite possible that both could legitimately patent their inventions.... just as the rotory and the piston engines can both…

Your understanding disagrees with current law.

Re: Apple Wins Patent Ruling As Jury Finds Samsung Infringes

#183

Post by RichardButler »

I wonder if this will actually end up hurting Apple's bottom line in the end. Samsung is one of Apples largest hardware providers and one of the few that can produce screens of sufficient resolution for Apple's retina displays. Wouldn't be surprised if Samsung recoups their loses just by raising their hardware prices.

Re: Apple Wins Patent Ruling As Jury Finds Samsung Infringes

#184

Post by Steko »

veemjeem wrote: post #139
Steko wrote: post #98

This is a good result. Samsung copies for a living like many companies. Much of the copying is legal. Sometimes they push it too far. One smoking gun in this case was the Google told Samsung to change their designs. They didn't. They reaped the benefits in terms of higher sales and now they can reap the bad side of that too. On net it has still been profitable from Samsung. Samsung lost but it hasn't been shut down o…

I don't understand the mindset of companies in the eastern hemisphere. I feel like the majority of companies in china / korea thrive by copying other successful company products to survive. It's more blatant in china, but it still happens in korea / japan. I feel like there must be some underlying cultural thing that promotes this kind of behavior -- nobody feels like they're doing the wrong thing.

People that pirate Gucci bags or Rolex watches know there's a law against it but there's lot of rules we take for granted. People that buy the stuff know too.

Do we stop watching a YT clip that we know is actual copyright infringement? I'll venture that most of us don't. I suppose most of us rationalize our behavior by saying the laws are excessive. I imagine the people who buy and sell pirate goods do something similar.

While copying electronics is more common in Asia it's not like Japan or China or Korea don't innovate or that the West isn't similarly full of copycats (look at the Samwer brothers or the generic products in your supermarket).

And that also misses the point that Samsung and other copyists do a lot of good for consumers by copying innovations, pushing prices down. In some industries the people that actually innovate do need some protections so that they can keep making those investments. Much like in actual piracy there's a risk reward element to copying as a business model and I'm sure that's all part of the calculus that Samsung does with their products. Like the factory that breaks environmental or labor laws -- they pay up sometimes but in the end they do it because they still come out ahead.

Re: Apple Wins Patent Ruling As Jury Finds Samsung Infringes

#185

Post by taligent »

nitrogen wrote: post #159
taligent wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How did Koh not interpret the law impartially ? The fact is that the Samsung lawyers failed to convince an independent jury of the general public. Koh had very little to do with it.

Koh had very little to do with it. Apart from approving or rejecting every piece of evidence and testimony the jury would receive, which power could easily be used to create a reality distortion field around the jury... I'm not actually accusing Koh, just noting that juries are shown a very carefully constructed picture that is largely controlled by the judge, and may or may not resemble reality.

But since you're not accusing Koh and have no evidence then basically what you wrote is irrelevant to this case.

Re: Apple Wins Patent Ruling As Jury Finds Samsung Infringes

#186

Post by freditup »

Interestingly, TechCrunch (http://techcrunch.com/2012/08/24/hang-on-a-minute-jurors-awa...) reports that some of the damages awarded to Apple were awarded without finding any patent infringements. In other words, the jury's report was quite a bit sloppy (maybe rushed?). Anyway, undoubtedly this will all be appealed, and the case could turn any direction.

A personal question - what is the double tap to zoom patent all about? It hardly seems to me, personally that that should be patentable. Just as there's no way, Google should be able to patent something like 'double-click to zoom' on Google Maps.

Re: Apple Wins Patent Ruling As Jury Finds Samsung Infringes

#187

Post by jellicle »

taligent wrote: post #15
lubos wrote: post #4

I was shocked to learn this case is basically being decided by people who have no idea what they are really deciding on. Here is the jury according to techcrunch 1. An electrical engineer 2. A homemaker 3. A construction worker 4. A young unemployed man who likes video games 5. An insurance agent 6. An ex-Navy avionics technician 7. A store operations manager for a cycling retailer 8. A project manager for wireless c…

What on earth are you talking about ? Juries around the world are compromised of ordinary people.

Not really true, in complex civil suits. Many countries use specialized, expert judges and courts to decide such matters.

Re: Apple Wins Patent Ruling As Jury Finds Samsung Infringes

#188

Post by taligent »

esolyt wrote: post #143
taligent wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except that it's NOT a highly technical issue. It's mainly a trade dress and UI look & feel issue. So the general public are absolutely the right people.

The case also covers some extremely technical patents.

True but it isn't central to the case.

The Samsung counterclaims really centered around the patent exhaustion issue. If the jury found that it did not apply in this case Apple would clearly have infringed.

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