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The wire that transforms much of Manhattan into one big, symbolic home (2017)

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Re: The wire that transforms much of Manhattan into one big, symbolic home (2017)

#161

Post by buran77 »

pdabbadabba wrote: post #159
buran77 wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> any loopholes in the rules were put there on purpose > The true sinners are those who think that they know what God wants better than what He actually passed down as commandments. God knows what He wants and wrote it down exactly like that. So it's just man who decides "this is a loophole and God wants me to use it". Man decides what God really wants. Man who not only looks for ways around God's word but he also cl…

I’m not a believer myself, but the response here seems obvious: by putting his law in writing, god invites (even demands) interpretation. What you are calling a “loophole” would just be a perhaps nonobvious but correct interpretation as applied to a particular set of facts.

> but the response here seems obvious: by putting his law in writing, god invites (even demands) interpretation.

You, just a man, purport to know what God invites and even demands us to do.

Re: The wire that transforms much of Manhattan into one big, symbolic home (2017)

#162

Post by lo_zamoyski »

bambax wrote: post #158
WJW wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He isn't, of course. According to Jewish thought, God is perfect and therefore any loopholes in the rules were put there on purpose. If you have studied the holy texts deeply enough to find the loophole, that makes you more holy, not less. It's like an easter egg for true believers. The true sinners are those who think that they know what God wants better than what He actually passed down as commandments. God knows w…

> God knows what He wants and wrote it down exactly like that. When the word of God has obvious contradictions and inconsistencies what does it mean? Are there little traps that He set up for us mortals? Is God mischievous?

> the word of God has obvious contradictions and inconsistencies

Such as?

Re: The wire that transforms much of Manhattan into one big, symbolic home (2017)

#163

Post by bawolff »

buran77 wrote: post #161
pdabbadabba wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m not a believer myself, but the response here seems obvious: by putting his law in writing, god invites (even demands) interpretation. What you are calling a “loophole” would just be a perhaps nonobvious but correct interpretation as applied to a particular set of facts.

> but the response here seems obvious: by putting his law in writing, god invites (even demands) interpretation. You, just a man, purport to know what God invites and even demands us to do.

Seems logical to me, either you believe you can understand the divine will by interpreting holy books or you don't. If you don't believe the divine will is knowable, then why would you follow any religion?

Re: The wire that transforms much of Manhattan into one big, symbolic home (2017)

#164

Post by bawolff »

thephyber wrote: post #152
focusgroup0 wrote: post #127

[flagged]

I interpret these acts (trying extremely hard to find loopholes in divine command) to be ways to absolve the observant religious person from the guilt. It has no affect on the god. It’s more of a “I can argue that I checked the box when I meet my maker and have to explain myself.” Also, hopefully nobody actually takes these rules so seriously that they end up hurting or killing anyone. There was a bicyclist who was i…

> Also, hopefully nobody actually takes these rules so seriously that they end up hurting or killing anyone. There was a bicyclist who was injured when one of these lines fell far below installation height, but I’m thinking more about, for example, people who need to use hospital equipment during the Sabbath.

They are supposed to ignore these rules if a life is at stake. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pikuach_nefesh

Re: The wire that transforms much of Manhattan into one big, symbolic home (2017)

#165

Post by AStonesThrow »

bawolff wrote: post #164
thephyber wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I interpret these acts (trying extremely hard to find loopholes in divine command) to be ways to absolve the observant religious person from the guilt. It has no affect on the god. It’s more of a “I can argue that I checked the box when I meet my maker and have to explain myself.” Also, hopefully nobody actually takes these rules so seriously that they end up hurting or killing anyone. There was a bicyclist who was i…

> Also, hopefully nobody actually takes these rules so seriously that they end up hurting or killing anyone. There was a bicyclist who was injured when one of these lines fell far below installation height, but I’m thinking more about, for example, people who need to use hospital equipment during the Sabbath. They are supposed to ignore these rules if a life is at stake. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pikuach_nefe…

[flagged]

Re: The wire that transforms much of Manhattan into one big, symbolic home (2017)

#166

Post by noworriesnate »

pdabbadabba wrote: post #159
buran77 wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> any loopholes in the rules were put there on purpose > The true sinners are those who think that they know what God wants better than what He actually passed down as commandments. God knows what He wants and wrote it down exactly like that. So it's just man who decides "this is a loophole and God wants me to use it". Man decides what God really wants. Man who not only looks for ways around God's word but he also cl…

I’m not a believer myself, but the response here seems obvious: by putting his law in writing, god invites (even demands) interpretation. What you are calling a “loophole” would just be a perhaps nonobvious but correct interpretation as applied to a particular set of facts.

The problem with looking to a dusty old book full of loopholes for your moral compass becomes evident when you realize that pedophilia is never condemned in the Bible, and as a result the Babylonian Talmud endorses it.

Re: The wire that transforms much of Manhattan into one big, symbolic home (2017)

#167

Post by 0xTJ »

Infinity315 wrote: post #85

[flagged]

I'm not Jewish, nor have I studied Jewish law/rules, but I don't think those could be justified as being sufficiently continuous. It's more of a network of various stations connected by discrete cables, rather than one big ring of fiber.

Re: The wire that transforms much of Manhattan into one big, symbolic home (2017)

#168

Post by samuel_navi »

Since people seem to be completely misunderstanding what the point of this is, or why it's even a problem in the first place, let's start with two simple definitions of what's going on:

1. In Jewish law, the definition of "work that is prohibited on the Sabbath" includes "moving objects outside the private domain".

2. The definition of "domain" has three kinds: "public domain" (such as a house), "private domain" (such as a highway), and "vineyard" (a catch-all term for "hard to define whether it's public or private").

Turns out, most of an average city in the world is "vineyard". The Eruv's function is to change the domain within it from "vineyard" to "private domain". That's it. No "fooling God", no loophole, just a simple way to create a legal status. Public domain remains public, private domain remains private, and now the grey area in between gets resolved. And there's a bonus of "there's a nice symbolism in the creation of a unified community boundary".

Re: The wire that transforms much of Manhattan into one big, symbolic home (2017)

#169

Post by aleph_minus_one »

graemep wrote: post #160
religiontrw wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I am Christian so do not think the same way about religious law Judaism isn't Christianity any more than Islam is. Trying to apply Christian norms to Jewish practices usually ends up in a pogrom when Christians realize that Judaism isn't Christianity. And just in case I hadn't said this enough: Judaism isn't Christianity. I have no idea why the right in America has run with the whole "Judaeo-Christian Western Cultur…

> Judaism isn't Christianity any more than Islam is All three share common beliefs and values. Christians and Jews worship the same God. Islam IS closely related to Judaism and Christianity and the Quran explicitly states Muslims worship the same God. > Trying to apply Christian norms to Jewish practices usually ends up in a pogrom when Christians realize that Judaism isn't Christianity. BS. Thinking about where we a…

> Islam IS closely related to Judaism and Christianity and the Quran explicitly states Muslims worship the same God.

This is like saying that Windows and GNU/Linux are closely related because they both run on PCs, and were both (Windows originally) written in C (thus worship the same "foundations"). :-)

> Christians use Jewish scriptures and prayers and symbolism.

Quite some applications have become ported from Windows to GNU/Linux or vice versa. There is also Wine. Also keep in mind that there exist people who use gcc to compile Windows applications.

Re: The wire that transforms much of Manhattan into one big, symbolic home (2017)

#170

Post by aleph_minus_one »

cam_l wrote: post #157
WJW wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An omniscient God can't be outwitted by stuff in the small print. If there's a loophole in the small print, God put it there on purpose. If anything, He would be delighted that some of his followers read the holy books closely enough to find some of the easter eggs that He put in there. The whole idea of "the spirit vs the letter of the law" is a secular one that came up as a result of imperfect human lawmakers. But…

God didn't write the texts.. people did. I mean, even apart from the fact god doesn't exist.

Don't interfer with their LARPG. :-)
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