Earlier quoted context omitted.
they were rich before ozempic
skinny too
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Denmark to raise retirement age to 70
431–440 of 1001 posts
Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70
#432Earlier quoted context omitted.
On the other hand, productivity has improved tremendously. It's not clear that we actually need everyone working.
Productivity improvements have been partially eaten up by cost of living increases. We don't need everyone working, but how do we decide who has to work and who gets stuff for free? Should workers pay higher taxes to support more retirees?
Cost of living doesn’t wipe out productivity increase. Cost of living is a money transfer. People buy things from other people. The question is therefore where is this money actually going. A casual look at how richness is shared in the USA will give you the answer to that.
Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70
#433Earlier quoted context omitted.
No one knows how to increase the birth rate. And all the studies show that immigration increases the budget deficit, not reduces it (at least in that way in which it is being implemented now).
Everyone knows. Stop contraception, stop woman education, stop abortions, reduce woman rights to 1800. Remove children rights, make environment where children are productive and bring profits to their parents, so they have financial incentive to create children. No one wants to implement it.
Right, if anyone here has taken a human geography course this is the obvious answer. This is why birthrate was so high for so long. As nations developed and gained rights for women, it went lower and lower and lower.
And it makes complete sense. The reality is having a child kind of sucks for a woman, and I, nor anyone else, can blame a large portion of women for just saying "eh... no". I would probably say no, too, although it's hard to tell, because I'm not a woman.
Having children was once a boon, because conditions were shit. Now it's a burden. So, people will treat it as a burden.
Either make it less burdensome or revert women. Nobody wants to do the latter, so we must do the former. We have to invest in children, because children are a Nation's investment.
Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70
#434This is truly sad. As a Swede I fear my country may follow suite. The retirement age in Sweden used to be 65 and now it's 67. Looking at older people around me, most lead a much less active life after 75. So, if we were lucky we used to have some 10 good years of doing whatever we wanted before old age and age-related diseases start affecting us so much we become limited to a much smaller world. But now we have maybe…
There's only one issue I can think of with your idea that someone who is 75 now leads a life as you're describing. The generation they belong to are predicted to live to what 80-85 years? Whilst we (assuming you're in your 40's now) are predicted to get to what 90-95 on average? Average lifespans are increasing, and on top of that the mobility of someone who's 75 now, won't be the same of someone who's 75 in another…
> are predicted to get to what 90-95 on average?
That may be true, but will we (who are in our 40's now) have the same quality of life at 90-95 as a now 75-year old will have at 80-85?
Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70
#435This is truly sad. As a Swede I fear my country may follow suite. The retirement age in Sweden used to be 65 and now it's 67. Looking at older people around me, most lead a much less active life after 75. So, if we were lucky we used to have some 10 good years of doing whatever we wanted before old age and age-related diseases start affecting us so much we become limited to a much smaller world. But now we have maybe…
There's only one issue I can think of with your idea that someone who is 75 now leads a life as you're describing. The generation they belong to are predicted to live to what 80-85 years? Whilst we (assuming you're in your 40's now) are predicted to get to what 90-95 on average? Average lifespans are increasing, and on top of that the mobility of someone who's 75 now, won't be the same of someone who's 75 in another…
Does anyone know if there's any kind of metrics for healthspans? Meaning the "good" part of life before it's just doctors, medicine and retirement homes.
My impression so far is that we've done a lot of work at the lifespan, less at the healthspan. What's the point of living until 90 if the last 15 years isn't that fun at all.
Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70
#436Earlier quoted context omitted.
In Denmark, you also have to have a medical exam to maintain your drivers license after you turn 70, but they have no problem with carpenters running around on roofs until they're 74.
Well you normally don't kill someone else if you fall off a roof. Running a car at highway speeds into something or someone else has a much higher chance of injuring or killing multiple people besides the driver.
“Older drivers have 3 to 20 times higher risk of fatal crash than non-older drivers” [1].
We simply don’t have those data for roofers.
[1] https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S01674...
Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70
#437Earlier quoted context omitted.
Well you normally don't kill someone else if you fall off a roof. Running a car at highway speeds into something or someone else has a much higher chance of injuring or killing multiple people besides the driver.
So that's the plan ? Make sure enough people die before reaching retirement age ? My point is, if you're unfit to drive a vehicle due to cognitive or physical decline, you're probably also unfit for most jobs involving those skills, and yet you have to soldier on for 4 more years. What happens when they're putting a new roof on a building next to a crowded street, and the 73 year old carpenter drops a bunch of tiles…
You can concoct these make believe hypotheticals, or you can look at countries where this is the reality (South Korea; high elderly poverty), and how there is no "elderly employee accident crisis". Whether it is right, moral, just etc. is the issue. I would just say to not wait until retirement to "live your life".
Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70
#438Earlier quoted context omitted.
Wouldn't the fourth way be via increasing either birth rate or immigration?
Raising the birth rate is extremely difficult and immigration will destroy a country's culture if not managed properly. For an interesting case study, compare Japan (who refuses to allow mass immigration and is at risk of going extinct) and the UK (who has embraced it and is on the way to becoming Muslim-majority). It'll be interesting to see in 50 years which one has had better outcomes.
> Raising the birth rate is extremely difficult
> the UK (who has embraced it and is on the way to becoming Muslim-majority)
.. Seems like we've found a fix for ;) I wonder what's the difference between Muslims in the UK vs Japanese folks.
Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70
#439Earlier quoted context omitted.
> How did it all go so right? The highest total tax rate in the world perhaps?
The USSR and Yugoslavia and Albania and Cuba and North Korea and Vietnam and China pre-2000s have all had far higher tax rates than Denmark during their worst times, so probably not a great correlation. Denmark is like all the other Nordic countries culturally, except they have much easier direct geographic lines to Central Europe. So it’s basically what you get when you combine the Nordic model (tiny homogenous Luth…
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Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70
#440Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I think if you've put in 40-45 years for the man, you should be allowed to have some good 10 years for yourself. Who do you think would "allow" this? God? This is a resource constraint imposed by reality itself catching up to an excessively idealistic set of policies; this policy decision is downstream of that, not arbitrary.
Of course there is no guarantee that your 65-75 years will be good, but it's a lot more likely that your 65-75 years will be good than your 75-85 years.
The point is, that the society does not owe you 10 years to do whatever.