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KDE is finally getting a native virtual machine manager called “Karton”

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Re: KDE is finally getting a native virtual machine manager called “Karton”

#91

Post by skydhash »

qalmakka wrote: post #59
bjoli wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I cane back to plasma after about year of gnome. It made me realize how much I dislike gnome. There are just so many issues. Inhad to solve them with extensions, but then it broke on updates. I couldn't get it to have English as language but ISO units. I had to install an extra app to control startup applications. Fractional scaling and several displays was wonky, made screen recording impossible. My 60fps display ha…

GNOME has great software, nice UI, horrible UX. It's like as if the designers actively tried to make their software as opinionated and as castrated as they physically could

GNOME is nice, but only if you only GNOME. Any attempt to alter the linux ecosystem beneath will result in a lot of pain.

Re: KDE is finally getting a native virtual machine manager called “Karton”

#92

Post by ipdashc »

vitorgrs wrote: post #42

I really like KDE in general, and how full featured it is, but their design just feels dated compared to all modern OSes and other DMs on Linux... The only reason why I'm a gnome user, it's because of that. And yes, I know I can just customize, but everytime I try, it just make KDE more sluggish for some reason, and doesn't really feels natural.

It's interesting to me that this is so common. I feel exactly the opposite way, as if KDE is the only one that feels modern and good-looking.

Not saying you're wrong, just that it's interesting how much perspectives differ on design, I suppose.

Re: KDE is finally getting a native virtual machine manager called “Karton”

#93

Post by c-hendricks »

justaj wrote: post #83
Aardwolf wrote: post #71

Why "finally"? To me, KDE's job should be to organize and render windows, application launcher icons, and the like If I want a virtual machine, I'll use a virtual machine for that All this "KDE suite" stuff and what not is unnecesarry - some of these are good pieces of software that I like to use, but there's no reason they need any integration with a desktop environment (arguably a few basics like a file manager, VT…

This. I tried Neon Stable a while ago and it felt like the developers were already spread thin across the KDE ecosystem. I think more projects like this (while not otherwise intended) will only exacerbate these issues.

For some reason I doubt this summer of code project by a university student will take meaningful development resources from the rest of KDE.

Re: KDE is finally getting a native virtual machine manager called “Karton”

#94

Post by darkwater »

yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #34
Narishma wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

KDE 4 was the bad one, not 3.

In fact, it was so unpopular that it inspired a fork of KDE 3: https://www.trinitydesktop.org/ (IMHO, later versions of KDE got good, but even today I understand the appeal of just sticking to the same thing)

And it still exists, by looking at the NEWS section! That's a long grudge to hold :)

Re: KDE is finally getting a native virtual machine manager called “Karton”

#95

Post by thaumaturgy »

hxorr wrote: post #23

I hope they can come up with a solution integrated into KDE where you can have apps running on a VM but appearing as a native Kwin window... Would probably need a helper daemon running on guest OS. I know a similar thing has been done before but would be great to have upstream support from a major DE

You can get pretty close to this with VirtualBox, which is one of two reasons I'm still using it.

I have multiple VMs running on my laptop. I can attach an external display and resize the VM windows. When detaching the display, the windows all resize back down automatically. With shared clipboard and a few other niceties, each VM feels pretty close to a native experience.

I have single-application VMs (e.g., the one that hosts my daily-driver browser environment that I'm typing into right now); those run a lightly customized openbox environment and the application is full-screened inside the VM. Those really feel like a Qubes-like experience, like a native application but inside a VM.

I also have purpose-specific VMs. For example, anytime I get started on a new contract, I spin up a new VM for it. All credentials, dev tooling, files, etc. for that project are contained inside that VM. I typically set it up so that there are multiple virtual desktops on my host environment, but a single desktop inside the VM; alt-tab switches tasks inside the VM but not the host environment. So, it's easy to switch "into" the project VM, work there for a while as naturally as I would if everything were native, and then switch out again as needed.

I really really want to swap all of the VirtualBox bits out with QEMU or KVM, but those aren't quite as polished just yet -- despite VirtualBox's numerous and sometimes work-stopping bugs, and the ever-looming threat of Oracle's litigation team.

Re: KDE is finally getting a native virtual machine manager called “Karton”

#96

Post by sph »

brokegrammer wrote: post #65

What KDE needs isn't new features but less bugs.

FWIW I have always complained about KDE's bugs, but since 6.3 I haven't suffered from anything major for the first time in a decade. Worth checking it out again if you haven't in a while.

Re: KDE is finally getting a native virtual machine manager called “Karton”

#97

Post by sph »

I love how 95% of the comments are about anything but the effing article.

Looking forward to a new VM manager. virt-manager is what I use and it's not very maintained: it still has issues on a HiDPI screen where scaling is all messed up. GNOME Boxes is both buggy and featureless in the usual GNOME sense, haven't found much use for it. I think all the focus has been on the virsh CLI and we haven't had a decent VM GUI in a while.

Re: KDE is finally getting a native virtual machine manager called “Karton”

#98

Post by babypuncher »

alexey-salmin wrote: post #37
Narishma wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

KDE 4 was the bad one, not 3.

Never understood that part really. I was using KDE 4 since 3.97rc2 (which wasn't easy to install and still had some glitches) and absolutely loved it.

I remember it being very slow and buggy, and missing a lot of features I liked in 3.5. Dolphin also felt like a big downgrade from Konqueror. I didn't start liking KDE again until Plasma 5.

Re: KDE is finally getting a native virtual machine manager called “Karton”

#99

Post by sph »

Aardwolf wrote: post #71

Why "finally"? To me, KDE's job should be to organize and render windows, application launcher icons, and the like If I want a virtual machine, I'll use a virtual machine for that All this "KDE suite" stuff and what not is unnecesarry - some of these are good pieces of software that I like to use, but there's no reason they need any integration with a desktop environment (arguably a few basics like a file manager, VT…

> Also, any integration attempts like making the icons a common asset rather than each application have their own, _fail_ and make things worse, with these integrations applications less often have working icons at all, and more often have mistakes like black icons against a black background making them invisible

One thing the GNOME community got right, despite the clamour and gnashing of teeth.

https://stopthemingmy.app/

Consistent cross-app theming support is a pipe dream from the 90s that has never worked, except in manicured screenshots to get karma points on /r/unixporn

Re: KDE is finally getting a native virtual machine manager called “Karton”

#100

Post by anthk »

sph wrote: post #99
Aardwolf wrote: post #71

Why "finally"? To me, KDE's job should be to organize and render windows, application launcher icons, and the like If I want a virtual machine, I'll use a virtual machine for that All this "KDE suite" stuff and what not is unnecesarry - some of these are good pieces of software that I like to use, but there's no reason they need any integration with a desktop environment (arguably a few basics like a file manager, VT…

> Also, any integration attempts like making the icons a common asset rather than each application have their own, _fail_ and make things worse, with these integrations applications less often have working icons at all, and more often have mistakes like black icons against a black background making them invisible One thing the GNOME community got right, despite the clamour and gnashing of teeth. https://stopthemingmy…

It did for me. Zukitre, which is gray neutral, and Papirus or any uber complete icon theme. Problem solved.
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