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Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

insideevs.com

301–310 of 848 posts

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#301

Hardware companies trying to build software, without actually understanding software. There's a reason why Apple, Nvidia, Tesla got where they got to.

Apple is not a software company, their software is absolute dog shit (for the amount of money they invest into it)

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#302
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A stupid requirement. Consider this. Almost every car on the road today has an unsecured bus going back to like the 1980s. However you need to actually access the car to do something malicious so the threat vector is zero; since if you have access to the car you can also just cut brakes or put in a pipe bomb. The only reason why this paradigm changes in the EV era is because the insistence on having EVs phone home. N…

> Almost every car on the road today has an unsecured bus going back to like the 1980s. However you need to actually access the car to do something malicious See [1] from 2023, where popping the headlight gives access to the bus. Lack of internal security then gives a way to steal the car. The threat just isn't the same as the one you are modeling. Security will come eventually, if only to prevent bad publicity. [1]:…

It begs to ask why a headlight ought to have a data connection and not just power connection like most other cars of say 20 years ago. But even then when does the arms race end? Someone given enough time can cake apart a car to access any piece of it. A slim jim gets you to the hood release and the ecu of a say 2000 honda civic in 20 seconds. Was this a real world issue however in the 2000s, people hacking into drive by wire early obdii era cars like the s2000 to assassinate them with misdirected inputs or whatever the threat vector might be? Not really. Old fashioned ways to screw with people are simpler and cheaper.

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#303

Where is the Apple car? Was the project canceled, and why?

Yes, Titan was cancelled in 2024 after eight years of development. There's a good breakdown on The Information about why, it mostly boils down to software challenges (especially ADAS), leadership turnover and a fair amount of internal skepticism that it was even a worthwhile project.

Apple had a secret test track in Arizona, with buildings made from shipping containers. You can see it on Google Maps under "Chrysler Oval Track".

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#304
post #10

The author mentions "military grade firewall", as a must have in a vehicle. Genuine question; What's a military grade firewall?

a firewall that prevents someone getting direct access to CAN bus and ECU, and sending messages like: "Key present", "Engine start", just by connecting to the wires of the headlight lamp (by prying a fender next to headlight)

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#305
post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mazda has done a great job at this so far, very minimal screen which automatically just shows CarPlay, and buttons for all the normal car stuff, which also isn’t overdone. The only flaw is the scroll wheel to interact with the screen, which is just slightly too clunky in apps with too many options

Mazda also managed to squander a huge brand and structural advantage by falling into lockstep behind other Japanese automakers in underinvesting in EV manufacturing infrastructure. Now they have to rely on their JV partner Changan to lead the way in producing EVs, giving up the core structural strengths that Mazda previously had in designing and building their own components - including software and controls, which i…

While that might affect their market share in HN neighborhoods I assure you Mazda is making money hand over fist selling their boring non-hybrid SUVs to normal people. People love them and they sell.

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I seem to remember Jeep saying manual window winders were actually more expensive once you factor in the costs of having them as an option given how cheap electric ones are when they dropped them for the new Wrangler. Might still be cheaper if you only manufacture with them and don’t offer electric but the price difference can’t be that high.

Is it about price or reliability? I never had a manual window winder fail to work, but electric window buttons breaking or the motor getting stuck (e.g. in icy conditions) has happened at some point in every car I've owned. The convenience factor hugely outweighs the rare failures for me, but I could see why someone buying a Wrangler for its intended purpose might actually prefer the manual option.

I've had manual winders fail

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#307
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A stupid requirement. Consider this. Almost every car on the road today has an unsecured bus going back to like the 1980s. However you need to actually access the car to do something malicious so the threat vector is zero; since if you have access to the car you can also just cut brakes or put in a pipe bomb. The only reason why this paradigm changes in the EV era is because the insistence on having EVs phone home. N…

The threat is not exactly zero. In some cases, thieves can get physical access to the bus from outside the car, and then inject messages to unlock it, start the engine, and drive away: https://kentindell.github.io/2023/04/03/can-injection/ Sure someone in that situation could also "just cut brakes or put in a pipe bomb" but car theft is a lot more common than assassination, at least where I live.

There are plenty of cars on the road today where theft is as easy as splicing two wires together. And yet grand theft auto isn’t very common at all even with all of these cars capable of being stolen in 10 seconds are being parked unsupervised on just about every block. Seems there are other filters in the overall system of society that are effective in keeping these unsecured cars from getting stolen today.

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Slate have done this and it's really quite compelling. You even get window winders. https://www.slate.auto/en/personalization

I was quite interested in this until I realized: * Bed size is just five feet * Towing capacity is just 1000 lbs * Not AWD None of these can be retrofitted after the sale. Where I live, it'd struggle to be called a "truck" with these limitations.

Meh. Base Maverick is a Not everyone wants to spend 40-80k on a bloated luxury-truck-ized F150 when they only need to carry something oversized maybe once a year.

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There could be a sort of "ARM" or "Android" but for cars. Come up with few general hardware modules, enough to replace the head unit, body controllers, ECU, climate control, and ideally driving automation, and software to run them. Everything minus safety modules like the airbag controllers, and then license them under Fair/non-discriminatory terms. Then, a variety of automakers get access to core functionality and c…

> "Android" but for cars. Is this not just Android Automotive? A lot of Volvos use it, it’s a lower-level OS type thing that sits below Android Auto or CarPlay.

Android Automative, so far as I understand, is basically a head unit. I don't think it does all the body controllers, self-driving, etc.

Re: Car companies are in a billion-dollar software war

#310
post #228

Remove the LTE chip and all functionality related to ads, support wireless CarPlay and android auto, and use physical buttons. You’ll win every award in the industry.

Removing LTE would remove key features that drivers want, including real time traffic updates, remote controls and streaming media? What's your objection to LTE?

If you keep that car for a decade or so the cellular connectivity may remove itself. Like it already did for 3g cars.

If you're gonna build that crap in at least go back to a standard-sized replacable module.

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