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Android phones will soon reboot themselves after sitting unused for three days

arstechnica.com

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Re: Android phones will soon reboot themselves after sitting unused for three days

#281

Post by dns_snek »

TylerE wrote: post #158
arghwhat wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is default on iOS and on many Android versions. It's often configurable, but e.g. carrier policy or local vendors can enforce it. To have updates automatically install overnight is the maximally desirable scenario - waiting for user approval usually result in open vulnerabilities, and if you interact with a prompt you are by definition using your device and it is therefore a much worse time than while you're asl…

I hate overnight updates because a dialed one means I have no alarm and will be hours late for work. And yes, this has actually happened to me at least twice.

On Android? It must be an app-specific issue because it's possible for apps to implement alarms so that they work before unlocking the device after a reboot, but I don't know the technical details behind it.

I've had that happen a few times and the alarms went off on time but they used the default alarm tune instead of the one I had selected, presumably that data was still encrypted.

Re: Android phones will soon reboot themselves after sitting unused for three days

#282

Post by 28304283409234 »

morpheuskafka wrote: post #253
Suppafly wrote: post #236

Mine randomly reboots semi-periodically already, even when it hasn't been shown as having downloaded an update. That said, I think this is a fairly good idea, although with the encryption stuff they do, this will cause people who rarely use their phones to miss calls and alarms.

It would be easy to store alarms in an unencrypted partition or even EEPROM as they take no space. Calls is a harder problem, although in principle if the SIM doesn’t have a PIN, you should have everything you need.

Except that after a reboot of my Android phone, it still asks confirmation to activate my SIM (even though it has no PIN).

Re: Android phones will soon reboot themselves after sitting unused for three days

#283

Post by seabass-labrax »

londons_explore wrote: post #270
oarsinsync wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> in a lot of shitty countries, even some pretending to be democratics, not disclosing or at least inputting your password might be a crime severely punished. If I'm not wrong, there was a guy that had to stay years in jail until he would comply with the judge order to unlock his device. This sounds a lot like the Regulation of Investigatory Powers Act 2000 in the United Kingdom, where several people have been prosec…

> imprisoned for failing to provide encryption keys This scares me, because I have plenty of old devices I no longer know the passwords for. I don't think I'm alone - plenty of people forget passwords they don't use in years. If the police came and searched my house, they could probably find some ancient laptop or phone from a decade ago, demand I unlock it, and then put me in prison forever when I cannot do do so.

Do SMART records contain enough information to prove that the laptop had not been used in years (assuming you had a suitably effective barrister to make use of this information)? RTC (clock) drift could also give a hint that the laptop had not been connected to a time server in a while.

Also (this may be of limited consolation) the officer who compels you to disclose the key must have some idea of what data it is protecting in order to satisfy RIPA 2000 s 51(5)(a):

> The matters to be taken into account in considering whether the requirement [for proportionality] of subsection (4)(b) is satisfied in the case of any direction shall include... the extent and nature of any protected information, in addition to the protected information in respect of which the disclosure requirement is imposed, to which the key is also a key

Re: Android phones will soon reboot themselves after sitting unused for three days

#284

Post by resource_waste »

rvnx wrote: post #50
greatgib wrote: post #34

It's good to have an option like that, even being a default, but there definitively need a switch to disable that if it is your own will. It's not even necessarily that good enough against cops, because in a lot of shitty countries, even some pretending to be democratics, not disclosing or at least inputting your password might be a crime severely punished. If I'm not wrong, there was a guy that had to stay years in…

Interestingly, it could also be seen the other way around; it's a potential way for Google to force deployments of system updates (potentially at the request of law enforcement). With an automatic reboot, then the update can automatically be applied without user action.

When Apple does it: "Brilliant! Love the security! Walled Prison!! Wooo"

When Google does it: "Google is using it to help the FBI"

(But the iphone was hacked by the FBI...)

Re: Android phones will soon reboot themselves after sitting unused for three days

#285

Post by glenstein »

sneak wrote: post #179
glenstein wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>not disclosing or at least inputting your password might be a crime severely punished And to your point, I believe it's now the case in the U.S. that you can be legally compelled to unlock a fingerprint lock, but not a pin for whatever reason.

Biometrics aren’t testimony. You don’t have to do anything for someone to hold a phone to your fingertip, or a camera to your face.

You have to be actively physically cooperative for both of those things.

An argument against being compelled to provide biometrics does not necessarily hinge on it being analogous to testimony.

Re: Android phones will soon reboot themselves after sitting unused for three days

#286

Post by AnonC »

gxs wrote: post #262
hnburnsy wrote: post #185

So the phone will reboot it self, but... 1) There is no developer accessible API to allow app developers to create an app to allow me to script power options (example, as an end user I want to script a restart or shut down my phone nightly). 2) Asking Google Assistant will not restart or shut down the phone. 3) Apple and Android have made it harder to shut down the phone, requiring double key press kung fu to even br…

FWIW on iPhone you can just create a shortcut to restart the phone One click for me and it restarts fyi

One click where? Have you mapped it to the Action button on the newer phone models? Or do you launch the shortcut by tapping somewhere (widget on Control Center or elsewhere)?

Re: Android phones will soon reboot themselves after sitting unused for three days

#287

Post by Braxton1980 »

londons_explore wrote: post #270
oarsinsync wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> in a lot of shitty countries, even some pretending to be democratics, not disclosing or at least inputting your password might be a crime severely punished. If I'm not wrong, there was a guy that had to stay years in jail until he would comply with the judge order to unlock his device. This sounds a lot like the Regulation of Investigatory Powers Act 2000 in the United Kingdom, where several people have been prosec…

> imprisoned for failing to provide encryption keys This scares me, because I have plenty of old devices I no longer know the passwords for. I don't think I'm alone - plenty of people forget passwords they don't use in years. If the police came and searched my house, they could probably find some ancient laptop or phone from a decade ago, demand I unlock it, and then put me in prison forever when I cannot do do so.

Wouldn't you be able to argue this in court for this rare case? With a phone that can be shown to be in use constantly it would be more difficult to prove you forgot

Re: Android phones will soon reboot themselves after sitting unused for three days

#288

Post by andylynch »

londons_explore wrote: post #270
oarsinsync wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> in a lot of shitty countries, even some pretending to be democratics, not disclosing or at least inputting your password might be a crime severely punished. If I'm not wrong, there was a guy that had to stay years in jail until he would comply with the judge order to unlock his device. This sounds a lot like the Regulation of Investigatory Powers Act 2000 in the United Kingdom, where several people have been prosec…

> imprisoned for failing to provide encryption keys This scares me, because I have plenty of old devices I no longer know the passwords for. I don't think I'm alone - plenty of people forget passwords they don't use in years. If the police came and searched my house, they could probably find some ancient laptop or phone from a decade ago, demand I unlock it, and then put me in prison forever when I cannot do do so.

If you get changed with a RIPA password offence it’s almost certain going to Crown Court and an (expensive!) jury trial.

CPS won’t (as a matter of policy, and also can’t afford to waste time and money) spend time trying to prosecute a forgotten password for old laptop, unless it’s connected to some other serious, evidenced, allegations.

(I was on a jury in just this situation. Reasonable doubt is a high bar and prosecutors know this).

Re: Android phones will soon reboot themselves after sitting unused for three days

#289

Post by nkrisc »

TylerE wrote: post #158
arghwhat wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is default on iOS and on many Android versions. It's often configurable, but e.g. carrier policy or local vendors can enforce it. To have updates automatically install overnight is the maximally desirable scenario - waiting for user approval usually result in open vulnerabilities, and if you interact with a prompt you are by definition using your device and it is therefore a much worse time than while you're asl…

I hate overnight updates because a dialed one means I have no alarm and will be hours late for work. And yes, this has actually happened to me at least twice.

I would consider an alarm clock, which has far fewer failure modes in this regard. You can even get ones with a battery backup.

These have existed for many decades.

Re: Android phones will soon reboot themselves after sitting unused for three days

#290

Post by nkrisc »

nradov wrote: post #168
mh- wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't had that happen on iOS, but I have woken up in the night needing my flashlight just to find my phone applying a lengthy update. I have it set to download automatically and install manually now, I believe.

You don't keep a real flashlight next to your bed?

I do, in my nightstand. In the event of an emergency where we’re without power, I do not want to waste my phone’s battery power by using it as a flashlight.
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