Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March • Hacker News Board

Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March

#441

Post by pseudalopex » Mon, Apr 07, 2025, 2:44 PM UTC

DeathArrow wrote: post #405

b112 wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

but I think it’s going to far to say most Americans don’t care about the impact elsewhere. Indeed. Recently in Palo Alto for a few months. Saw lots of people protesting Tesla dealerships, lots of interesting and creative anti-Trump and Elon signs. Not one word of Canada, of Greenland. Trumps stated goal of destroying Canada's economy to force annexation, or to outright just take Greenland seem not protest worthy. Mos…

Why should US citizens deeply care about Canada? It's not their country, they don't live there. Don't tell me Canadians lose sleep thinking about the well being of US.

> Why should US citizens deeply care about Canada?

You don't have to deeply care about Canada to oppose annexation threats.

> Don't tell me Canadians lose sleep thinking about the well being of US.

A Canadian prime minister said Living next to you is in some ways like sleeping with an elephant. No matter how friendly and even-tempered is the beast, if I can call it that, one is affected by every twitch and grunt.[1]

[1] https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Pierre_Trudeau#1969

Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March

#442

Post by abenga » Mon, Apr 07, 2025, 2:47 PM UTC

bilbo0s wrote: post #391

oblio wrote: post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trump was elected twice. The fact that that happened shows something is deeply wrong in the US. The US government, (mostly) democratically elected, has decided to harm the rest of the world. Even if there are good people in the US, they can't seem to win. So one could argue, what use are the good people in the US, for everyone else? So the reaction is kind of expected and natural.

Fair point. I'll allow it. But that doesn't change the fact that there are good people in the US. But good and bad are a bit irrelevant. I believe it was a mistake to go poking Europe with a stick because there are 600 million people there. Most far better educated than us. They were perfectly contented to sleep in the then current global order, and willing to help with maintaining that order if called on in an emerg…

> But that doesn't change the fact that there are good people in the US.

That doesn't matter when the bad people are running the border crossing and could ruin your life on a whim.

Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March

#443

Post by ty6853 » Mon, Apr 07, 2025, 2:48 PM UTC

Nostrada wrote: post #440

orwin wrote: post #427

People of my family are flying in in March. New restrictions are in place for people who visited specific countries. My only advice to fellow Europeans who want to travel to the US is to get issued a new passport and, if you have to, lie on your ESTA if you spent any time in Cuba or in the Middle East since 2011 (Your trips are linked to your passport ID)

Lying to the border police is a terrible idea

You should not lie to them, but they basically play a huge bluff game. They will scare you into thinking they know all. They do not, they are largely playing a confidence game. Cartel members or their clients who are coached will make it through no problem with the right story if they already have a visa. A relatively innocent european who admits they are going to tattoo someone, because they are naive, will get sniffed out and crucified.

I have been to Iraq and Syria so I have been subjected to imprisonment and/or intense questioning almost everytime I enter. I'm pretty familiar with their system and interrogation techniques.

Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March

#444

Post by baxtr » Mon, Apr 07, 2025, 2:49 PM UTC

lawn wrote: post #430

baxtr wrote: post #356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But this is only true if things have changed. That's why I am asking if we know that the number of incidents went up compared to last year or if it was in the same range but without the media coverage.

You assume that being detained is the only thing you're thinking about. Not wanting to support the US for plunging the whole world into economic turmoil or not wanting to support a country speed running into fascism are other reasons.

True! Thanks for pointing this out. Was indeed assuming this.

Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March

#445

Post by kccqzy » Mon, Apr 07, 2025, 2:52 PM UTC

DeathArrow wrote: post #335

alxlaz wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

^ this. Once (oh, actually twice!) while travelling, I have had entirely benign trouble with paperwork (things like not filling a form correctly on the first attempt). Explaining the circumstances to someone who has to figure out if you're scatter-brained, unlucky, or an actual criminal, isn't particularly fun, but it's been entirely professional and civilised. We resolved it all in about half an hour. Didn't even mi…

So you genuinely think that if you go to the US you have a high risk of being imprisoned without due process even if you you don't break any US law?

From what I understand, being arrested at the U.S. border while entering the country is strictly worse than being arrested by regular police while inside the U.S. In the latter case, the police arresting you will at least read you your Miranda rights, will have no right to search your phone unless authorized by a warrant, and will generally offer bail to get out of the jail in exchange for a court appearance. That's what due process, at a minimum, entails.

None of that happens at the border.

At this stage it doesn't even matter whether you have broken any U.S. law or not.

Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March

#446

Post by paulgb » Mon, Apr 07, 2025, 2:55 PM UTC

belter wrote: post #390

vain wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This at least reflects my feelings about visiting anytime soon. I mean if I was just put on a flight back (for a tweet they found on my phone or such), that'd be kind of bearable. At least one visitor from the UK got locked up in a facility for a week.

"Aussie MMA Coach’s Trip to America Goes Horribly Wrong as He Ends Up in Jail & Deported After Arriving in U.S." - https://www.essentiallysports.com/ufc-mma-news-aussie-mma-co...

His story is a bit suspicious to me, I believe that he was detained but I can't help wondering if the rest is fiction based on watching US prison dramas. He would not have been sent to a federal prison for one thing, and his depictions of violence are what I would expect from long-term convicted felons, not people being held for having the wrong visa.

Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March

#447

Post by DeathArrow » Mon, Apr 07, 2025, 2:56 PM UTC

PaulRobinson wrote: post #54

If non-US citizens can be deported to El Salvador without due process for having a tattoo that an ICE officer deems to be "gang-related", you're immediately going to alienate most of the World's population from wanting to visit for any purpose. The lack of due process and the threat of extradition on a whim is one that feels less likely to happen to me as a caucasian with US citizens as family, but the impact of it w…

[flagged]

Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March

#448

Post by UncleEntity » Mon, Apr 07, 2025, 2:57 PM UTC

bilbo0s wrote: post #391

oblio wrote: post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trump was elected twice. The fact that that happened shows something is deeply wrong in the US. The US government, (mostly) democratically elected, has decided to harm the rest of the world. Even if there are good people in the US, they can't seem to win. So one could argue, what use are the good people in the US, for everyone else? So the reaction is kind of expected and natural.

Fair point. I'll allow it. But that doesn't change the fact that there are good people in the US. But good and bad are a bit irrelevant. I believe it was a mistake to go poking Europe with a stick because there are 600 million people there. Most far better educated than us. They were perfectly contented to sleep in the then current global order, and willing to help with maintaining that order if called on in an emerg…

> And heaven help the rest of the world if the Europeans, the Chinese, and the Africans ever figure out that if they work together they don't really need the rest of us.

That's the part I just don't understand, they think after the willful crash of the US economy the rest of the world will bail us out because...

It makes a lot more sense to invest the "seven trillion dollars" or whatever number they're throwing around in their own economies rather than build up the manufacturing base of someone else. Spanish factories in Spain versus Spanish factories in the US.

Then, assuming these companies do invest all this money in the US, they will just complain how the foreigners are buying up all the "strategic assets" and are a "clear and present danger" to American Sovereignty. America is not for sale, don't ya know?

Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March

#449

Post by davidmurdoch » Mon, Apr 07, 2025, 2:58 PM UTC

ty6853 wrote: post #426

otikik wrote: post #348

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It does count for me. The border crossing is the first experience that you get from a country. It has definitely gone worse. And it was not great to begin with. In the past, I had the ... pleasure ... of being put in the "back room" for 3 hours after a long transatlantic flight at SFO. I was not afraid then, just annoyed and tired. I would be afraid now and I would rather avoid it. There's many other places I can cho…

I am still in debt from the last time they took me to the back room, did some kind of x-ray which detected my belt buckle. They declared the belt buckle was actually drugs up my ass, they strip searched me, and they then dragged me to two different hospitals chained and shackled and then sent me the bill when nothing was found. For this, the AUSA issued a retroactive search warrant, signed after they did it.

Sorry to hear about your traumatic encounter. Was this all after Trump's ICE enforcement changes? In any case, if you haven't already started this already, there are certainly US law firms that would love to take your case pro-bono, as in the US the government foots the bill for compelled medical exams unless the person was later found guilty. Also, the US Fourth Amendment requires warrants to be issues before searches except in exigent circumstances, so it was either exigent -- and a warrant wouldn't be legally required, or is an illegal warrant. This case sounds like it be a legal goldmine for you and your legal representative, especially now with all the public light being shed on invalid detainment.

Re: Foreign visits into the U.S. fell off a cliff in March

#450

Post by dfxm12 » Mon, Apr 07, 2025, 2:58 PM UTC

davidmurdoch wrote: post #424

dfxm12 wrote: post #387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but reading over this thread, you've made it clear how you've misinterpreted the post you originally responded to.

How so? The article doesn't mention the value of travel in the US. The comment "It also happens to be ridiculously overpriced for what you get as a tourist" is clearly adding an _another_ reason they (suspect?) tourism declined. It is followed with "But yes, there is also the political climate.", which I interpreted as an agreement with the reasons in the article -- that the decline was due to the political climate.…

The biggest reason is that pricing is not part of local culture. Politics is.

To take this a step further, it doesn't matter where you enter the country, even if it is a place where the people are generally nice and specifically sympathetic to tourists getting detained, the first person you're dealing with is an LEO at border control & they are all following the same orders. They appear to be going out of their way to look for reasons (on your cell phone, tattoos, etc.) to send you back home. God forbid you have a run in with another cop after you've entered the country...