If you want your lights or music connected to the internet, I can understand that, but NO HEAT PRODUCING APPLIANCES SHOULD BE CONNECTED TO THE INTERNET. If someone wants to burn down your house, make them come over and do it the old fashioned way. Do not let them do it remotely from another country.
I won't connect my dishwasher to your cloud
501–510 of 682 posts
Re: I won't connect my dishwasher to your cloud
#502Earlier quoted context omitted.
These days, Bosch is wholly owned by Siemens. And their appliances are basically the same. Except Bosch is now their experimental branch, where they try out ideas for products. Only those that are successful become Siemens products. So uhm, just buy a Siemens dishwasher, it's unlikely to have an app requirement.
It’s there other way around. Robert Bosch acquired the stake in Siemens. So Bosch owns Siemens. https://web.archive.org/web/20140923104028/http://www.rttnew...
The article says Bosh bought Siemens' stake in BSH Hausgeräte (which does use the Siemens brand for some of it's home appliance models), not that Bosh acquired a stake in Siemens.
Re: I won't connect my dishwasher to your cloud
#503Earlier quoted context omitted.
Sounds not so much like a Bosch problem as a retailer problem. It was the retailer that lied to you about the machine.
Requiring internet for features that don't need the internet is a manufacturer problem, no matter what any retailer says or doesn't say.
I'll grant you that, but many other manufacturers are doing that too. I avoid buying those models. If it says "wifi", I avoid it like the plague.
Re: I won't connect my dishwasher to your cloud
#504Earlier quoted context omitted.
The weird thing about eco modes is that they often don’t use less water or power. I live off grid, and just as a function of my setup I know exactly what consumes what. My Bosch dishwasher, on a normal 70C dish cycle, uses about 4.5L of water and 1.6kWh. On eco mode, it uses 8L of water, and 1.8kWh. Takes twice as long though. Similar with my AEG washer - a 40 degree cotton wash uses marginally more water than a 40 d…
Is 70c normal? Wont that mess up plastic items?
Yes, it's normal (should be above 65C, anyway). Yes, even "dishwasher-safe" plastic items often warp or discolor in a normal hot dishwashing cycle. I wouldn't put anything plastic or fragile in the dishwasher, but virtually everything in the kitchen is ceramic, glass, or stainless steel, so.
Re: I won't connect my dishwasher to your cloud
#505Earlier quoted context omitted.
In terms of a threat-risk analysis, the need of a physical microphone nearby i imagine more than makes up for the risk of an adversary knowing your water quality and electrical consumption as measured by your washer in almost everyones lives atleast..
It also indicates when you are home or out, and likely an estimate of how many people live there. It could collect more data. Those pieces of data are combined with others, to form a full picture. This device doesn't need to collect it all itself. Survellance of private citizens is arguably the foundation of the very dangerous problems in societies around the world, taking away freedom, health, peace, and for most, p…
> It also indicates when you are home or out
Yeah, being able to record sounds that the washer makes would probably also enable you to analyze things people say and extract much more information than 'how many people live there' and 'are they home or not'.
But fortunately for us, you need to actually press a physical button to make the machine sing the diagnostics..
Re: I won't connect my dishwasher to your cloud
#506I feel Jeff should have bit the bullet and just returned it. I know it's a waste of time, but these products have to be rejected at retail. Retailers will eventually get tired of the extra support burden and demand manufacturers drop stuff like this. They should all get hit with the open box problem from the returns.
I'd love to take a stance like that, but the reality is I've already sunk about 6 hours total into the whole operation, and I have quite limited time for my home maintenance + improvement projects as it is (my bench currently has a new faucet set to fix the leaky bathroom faucet, as well as an exhaust fan to fix the broken one in our bathroom... and those are just the things that are currently broken , not the dozen…
Except if customers like you don't take a stand now then by the time you get a replacement all the other Brands (some of which are made by the same company as Bosh appliances) will have likely moved to the same bullshit.
Re: I won't connect my dishwasher to your cloud
#507Bosch! I ran into the same situation. I specifically told the salesperson I didn't want wifi, and they told me it's only if you want it to operate from your phone. I was done installing it and got rid of the packaging by the time I read that it needs to use their website for some functions. Beside the fact that I doubt the store would take it back after using it for a week or two and havi go no packaging, I had no ti…
Genuinely, what about my dishwasher would I want to control from my phone? The only operations I do on it are turn it on (redundant because I need to load it first, which needs me to be there) and check if it's done, mostly redundant because it's not a time-sensitive operation.
Re: I won't connect my dishwasher to your cloud
#508If it takes you an hour and a half to wash a few dishes, you probably have a LOT more issues than this article describes....
Re: I won't connect my dishwasher to your cloud
#509Earlier quoted context omitted.
This reminds me of the EU regulations, which not only: 1. _require_ dishwashers to have an Eco mode, not locked behind anything, but also 2. _require_ Eco mode to be the default . If you buy a dishwasher in the EU and turn it on, and press "start", it'll be on Eco mode, the mode that uses the least water/power. If you don't care about the dishwasher other than to turn it on, and it works for you, then everybody wins.…
Why would a German company apply feel-good but ultimately counter-productive regulation to customers where they don't have to?
> counter-productive
The opposite, actually. Productive. Millions of litres of water and terawatts of power saved per year. End users collectively saving €1.3 billion on water and electricity costs in 2020 (in comparison to them having standard dishwashers from 1990 before any eco targets were set)
https://energy-efficient-products.ec.europa.eu/product-list/...
Re: I won't connect my dishwasher to your cloud
#510If it takes you an "hour and a half" to wash a few dishes, I'd say you have bigger issues than what you're whining about here...