Maybe this data constraint from data vs GPU constraint for China will force America to innovate. Maybe innovate in data generation
OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules
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Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules
#112private property is sacrosanct except when an exception that only applies to them it would make a billionaire richer
Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules
#113Earlier quoted context omitted.
Can I download a book without paying for it, and print copies of it? Stash copies in my bathroom, the gym, my office, my bedroom etc. to basically have a copy on hand to study from whenever I have some free time? What about movies and music?
That's not a one-to-one analogy. The LLM isn't giving you the book, its giving you information it learned from the book. The analogous scenario is "Can I read a book and publish a blog post with all the information in that book, in my own words?", and under US copyright law, the answer is: Yes.
> The analogous scenario is "Can I read a book and publish a blog post with all the information in that book, in my own words?"
The analogous scenario is actually "Can I read a book that I obtained illegally and face no consequences for obtaining it illegally?" The answer is "Yes" there are no consequences for reading said book, for individuals or machines.
But individuals can face serious consequences for obtaining it illegally. And corporations are trying to argue those consequences shouldn't apply to them.
Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules
#114Earlier quoted context omitted.
Can I download a book without paying for it, and print copies of it? Stash copies in my bathroom, the gym, my office, my bedroom etc. to basically have a copy on hand to study from whenever I have some free time? What about movies and music?
That's not a one-to-one analogy. The LLM isn't giving you the book, its giving you information it learned from the book. The analogous scenario is "Can I read a book and publish a blog post with all the information in that book, in my own words?", and under US copyright law, the answer is: Yes.
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Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules
#115>Chris Lehane, OpenAI’s vice president of global affairs, said in an interview that the US AI Safety Institute – a key government group focused on AI – could act as the main point of contact between the federal government and the private sector. If companies work with the group voluntarily to review models, the government could provide them “with liability protections including preemption from state based regulations…
> ask for regulation then ask for exempt
That's exactly what has been happening:
Ask HN: Why is OpenAI pushing for regulation so much - 2023
Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules
#116Earlier quoted context omitted.
when it comes to real people, they get sued into oblivion for downloading copyrighted content, even for the purpose of learning. but when facebook & openai do it, at a much larger scale, suddenly the laws must be changed.
It does apply to people? When you read a copy of a book, you can't be sued for making a copy of the book in the synapses of your brain. Now, if you have eidetic memory and write out large chunks of the book from memory and publish them, that's what you could be sued for.
This is not about memory or training. The LLM training process is not being run on books streamed directly off the internet or from real-time footage of a book.
What these companies are doing is:
1. Obtain a free copy of a work in some way.
2. Store this copy in a format that's amenable to training.
3. Train their models on the stored copy, months or years after step 1 happened.
The illegal part happens in steps 1 and/or 2. Step 3 is perhaps debatable - maybe it's fair to argue that the model is learning in the same sense as a human reading a book, so the model is perhaps not illegally created.
But the training set that the company is storing is full of illegally obtained or at least illegally copied works.
What they're doing before the training step is exactly like building a library by going with a portable copier into bookshops and creating copies of every book in that bookshop.
Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules
#117> OpenAI has asked the Trump administration to help shield artificial intelligence companies from a growing number of proposed state regulations if they voluntarily share their models with the federal government. That sounds like corruption
I'm shocked
Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules
#118Earlier quoted context omitted.
> just like a model could It is not remotely the same, the companies training the models are stealing the content from the internet and then profiting from it when they charge for the use of those models.
> the companies training the models are stealing the content from the internet Are you stealing a billboard when you see and remember it? The notion that consuming the web is "stealing" needs to stop.
The question is whether it destroys the incentive to produce the work. That is the entire point of copyright and patent law.
LLMs do indeed significantly reduce the incentive to produce original work.
Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules
#119Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's not true that it never works. Centralizing production goals, decision making, and expenditure at the Federal government is what made the industrial response to WW2 successful. Centralizing tax revenue to fund retirements for the elderly (Social Security) resulted in the poverty rate of seniors being brought far lower. Centralizing zoning control at the state of California is _finally_ starting to make localities…
Problem is, once you centralize, that remains in place for a long time, but the original intent, even if it was genuine, rarely outlives the people who implemented it for long. Generally speaking, every point of centralization is also a point where a lot of power can be acquired with relatively little resources. So regardless of intent, it attracts people who are into power, and over time, they take over. The origina…
> Generally speaking, every point of centralization is also a point where a lot of power can be acquired with relatively little resources
This is why (1) shared principles and (2) credible democracy is important, to allow evolution of the centralized power (i.e. government) towards the shared principles, and why its corporate-bribed facsimile or oligarchic authoritarianism don't work.
Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules
#120Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's not a one-to-one analogy. The LLM isn't giving you the book, its giving you information it learned from the book. The analogous scenario is "Can I read a book and publish a blog post with all the information in that book, in my own words?", and under US copyright law, the answer is: Yes.
> The analogous scenario is "Can I read a book and publish a blog post with all the information in that book, in my own words?" The analogous scenario is actually "Can I read a book that I obtained illegally and face no consequences for obtaining it illegally?" The answer is "Yes" there are no consequences for reading said book, for individuals or machines. But individuals can face serious consequences for obtaining…
> But individuals can face serious consequences for obtaining it illegally.
Can they? Who has ever faced serious consequences for pirating books in the US?