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OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules

finance.yahoo.com

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Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules

#71

Post by corndoge »

nwhnwh wrote: post #21
Cheer2171 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I hate this game. This is tech. This is how it has always been. From Archemedes to DaVinci to Edison to Ford, technologists are always captured to serve the interests of those in power. Most modern technologists don't want to believe this. They grew up building an Internet that had a bit of countercultural flair to it and undermined a few subsets of entrenched elites (mass media, taxi cartels, etc.), so they convin…

Could you please recommend a book about this?

A Canticle for Leibowitz

Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules

#72

Post by nightpool »

triceratops wrote: post #36
TheSoftwareGuy wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It already applies to real people, doesn't it? I.e. if you read a book, you're not allowed to start printing and selling copies of that book without permission of the copyright owner, but if you learn something from that book you can use that knowledge, just like a model could.

Can I download a book without paying for it, and print copies of it? Stash copies in my bathroom, the gym, my office, my bedroom etc. to basically have a copy on hand to study from whenever I have some free time? What about movies and music?

Yes, you're allowed to make personal copies of copyright works that you own. IANAL, but my understanding is that if you're using them for yourself, and you're not prevented from doing so by some sort of EULA or DRM, there's nothing in copyright law preventing you from e.g. photocopying a book and keeping a copy at home, as long as you don't distribute it. The test case here has always been CDs—you're allowed to make copies of CDs you legally own and keep one at home and one in your car.

Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules

#73

Post by lmc »

Cheer2171 wrote: post #17
gkoberger wrote: post #7

I hate this game. I hate that Sam Altman publicly supported Trump (both financially and by showing up). Maybe I hate that he "had" to do this for the sake of his company, or maybe I hate that he _didn't_ have to do it and is a hypocrite. Maybe I just hate how easily laws can be shaped by $1M and a few nice words. Either way, I hate that it worked.

> I hate this game. This is tech. This is how it has always been. From Archemedes to DaVinci to Edison to Ford, technologists are always captured to serve the interests of those in power. Most modern technologists don't want to believe this. They grew up building an Internet that had a bit of countercultural flair to it and undermined a few subsets of entrenched elites (mass media, taxi cartels, etc.), so they convin…

Apple seem to be holding the line ok:

https://www.reuters.com/technology/apple-investors-reject-pr...

https://news.sky.com/story/apple-removes-end-to-end-security...

Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules

#74

Post by triceratops »

nightpool wrote: post #72
triceratops wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can I download a book without paying for it, and print copies of it? Stash copies in my bathroom, the gym, my office, my bedroom etc. to basically have a copy on hand to study from whenever I have some free time? What about movies and music?

Yes, you're allowed to make personal copies of copyright works that you own. IANAL, but my understanding is that if you're using them for yourself, and you're not prevented from doing so by some sort of EULA or DRM, there's nothing in copyright law preventing you from e.g. photocopying a book and keeping a copy at home, as long as you don't distribute it. The test case here has always been CDs—you're allowed to make…

CDs, software, and electronic media, yes. Physical books, no. You can't make archival copies.

Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules

#75

Post by mystraline »

nwhnwh wrote: post #21
Cheer2171 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I hate this game. This is tech. This is how it has always been. From Archemedes to DaVinci to Edison to Ford, technologists are always captured to serve the interests of those in power. Most modern technologists don't want to believe this. They grew up building an Internet that had a bit of countercultural flair to it and undermined a few subsets of entrenched elites (mass media, taxi cartels, etc.), so they convin…

Could you please recommend a book about this?

Wealth of Nations (read past pg 50, unlike most current economists)

Das kapital, as a critique to Smith's writing.

Communist manifesto, to understand the point of the laborer, and not capital.

Read about worker cooperatives and democracy in the workplace, including Mondragon corp in Spain.

(One of the largest problems we have with any economic system is that none can properly model infinites. The cost of creating new is expensive be it art or science. But cost of copying is effectively 0. I can highlight the problem, but I have no good solution. But OpenAI's response is 'let us ignore copyright law' which wrongs creators.)

Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules

#76

Post by nickthegreek »

notatoad wrote: post #60
triceratops wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can I download a book without paying for it, and print copies of it? Stash copies in my bathroom, the gym, my office, my bedroom etc. to basically have a copy on hand to study from whenever I have some free time? What about movies and music?

>Can I download a book without paying for it if you have evidence that openAI is doing this with books that are not freely available, i'm sure the publishers would absolutely love to hear about it.

We know Meta has done it. These companies have torrented or downloaded books that they did not pay for. Things like the The Pile, libgen, anna's library were scraped to build these models.

Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules

#77

Post by lawlessone »

notatoad wrote: post #60
triceratops wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can I download a book without paying for it, and print copies of it? Stash copies in my bathroom, the gym, my office, my bedroom etc. to basically have a copy on hand to study from whenever I have some free time? What about movies and music?

>Can I download a book without paying for it if you have evidence that openAI is doing this with books that are not freely available, i'm sure the publishers would absolutely love to hear about it.

>if you have evidence that openAI is doing this with books that are not freely available, i'm sure the publishers would absolutely love to hear about it.

Lol, so why are OpenAI challenging these laws?

Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules

#78

Post by triceratops »

ajross wrote: post #56
triceratops wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can I download a book without paying for it, and print copies of it? Stash copies in my bathroom, the gym, my office, my bedroom etc. to basically have a copy on hand to study from whenever I have some free time? What about movies and music?

> Can I download a book without paying for it, and print copies of it? No, but you can read a book, learn its contents, and then write and publish your own book to teach the information to others. The operation of an AI is rather closer to that than it is to copyright violation. "Should" there be protections against AI training? Maybe! But copyright law as it stands is woefully inadequate to the task, and IMHO a lot…

But I can't legally obtain the book to read and learn from without me (or a library) paying for it. Let's start there first.

Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules

#79

Post by Terretta »

crorella wrote: post #53
TheSoftwareGuy wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It already applies to real people, doesn't it? I.e. if you read a book, you're not allowed to start printing and selling copies of that book without permission of the copyright owner, but if you learn something from that book you can use that knowledge, just like a model could.

> just like a model could It is not remotely the same, the companies training the models are stealing the content from the internet and then profiting from it when they charge for the use of those models.

> the companies training the models are stealing the content from the internet

Are you stealing a billboard when you see and remember it?

The notion that consuming the web is "stealing" needs to stop.

Re: OpenAI asks White House for relief from state AI rules

#80

Post by conjectures »

m1el wrote: post #32
TheSoftwareGuy wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It already applies to real people, doesn't it? I.e. if you read a book, you're not allowed to start printing and selling copies of that book without permission of the copyright owner, but if you learn something from that book you can use that knowledge, just like a model could.

when it comes to real people, they get sued into oblivion for downloading copyrighted content, even for the purpose of learning. but when facebook & openai do it, at a much larger scale, suddenly the laws must be changed.

It does apply to people? When you read a copy of a book, you can't be sued for making a copy of the book in the synapses of your brain.

Now, if you have eidetic memory and write out large chunks of the book from memory and publish them, that's what you could be sued for.

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