Earlier quoted context omitted.
It definitely adds value to the conversation - we're all human, we're all unsure about the future and our place in it. I'm just scared about a future where humans (say the next generation, kids 1-5 years of age right now) lack in-depth knowledge of almost everything and it's mostly AI writing low-level code, so there are no more "human experts." We've already seen this happening where Gen Z mostly interacts with the…
You see this with high level languages now. Memory management much less assembly are things of a bygone era.
Gemini Robotics
321–330 of 588 posts
Re: Gemini Robotics
#322I'm a firmware engineer that's been working in consumer electronics and I feel very bleak about my future I feel so left behind. I have extremely limited robotics and computer vision experience. I have no ML experience. The only math I know has to do with basic signal processing. When I see open roles at these companies I think the projects I'm going to work on in the future will be more and more irrelevant to societ…
Get concerned when you see a real product in the market that has a sustainable business model. The man behind the curtain here has an army of engineers, unlimited cloud nodes and basically has harvested all the data currently available in the world. It doesn't get any better than this right now. What's next? They'll ping you later on Linked-in with this awesome idea that you need to make sure runs in a $1 USD microco…
What scares me more is the opposite of that: information scarcity leading to less accessible intelligence on newer topics.
I’ve completely stopped posting on Reddit since the API changes, and I was extremely prolific before[1] because I genuinely love writing about random things that interest me. I know I’m not the only one: anecdotally, the overall quality of content on Reddit has nosedived since the change and while there doesn’t seem to be a drop in traffic or activity, data seems to indicate that the vast majority of activity these days is disposable meme content[2]. This seems to be because they’re attempting desperately to stick recommendation algorithms everywhere they can, which are heavily weighted toward disposable content since people view more of it. So even if there were just as many long discussion posts like before, they’re not getting surfaced nearly as often. And discussion quality when it does happen has noticeably dipped as well: the Severance subreddit has regularly gotten posts and comments where people question things that have already been fully explained in the series itself (not like subtext kind of things, like “a character looked at the camera and blatantly said that in the episode you’re talking about having just watched” things). Those would have been heavily downvoted years ago, now they’re the norm.
But if LLMs learn from the in-depth posting that used to be prominent across the Internet, and that kind of in-depth posting is no longer present, a new problem presents itself. If, let’s say, a new framework releases tomorrow and becomes the next big thing, where is ChatGPT going to learn how that framework works? Most new products and platforms seem to centralize their discussion on Discord, and that’s not being fed into any LLMs that I’m aware of. Reddit post quality has nosedived. Stack Overflow keeps trying to replace different parts of its Q&A system with weird variants of AI because “it’s what visitors expect to see these days.” So we’re left with whatever documentation is available on the open Internet, and a few mediocre-quality forum posts and Reddit threads.
An LLM might be able to pull together some meaning out of that data combined with the existing data it has. But what about the framework after that? And the language after that? There’s less and less information available each time.
“Model collapse” doesn’t seem to have panned out: as long as you have external human raters, you can use AI-generated information in training. (IIRC the original model collapse discussions were the result of AI attempting to rate AI generated content and then feed right back in; that obviously didn’t work since the rater models aren’t typically any better than the generator models.) But what if the “data wells” dry up eventually? They can kick the can down the road for a while with existing data (for example LLMs can relate the quirks of new languages to the quirks of existing languages, or text to image models can learn about characters from newer media by using what it already knows about how similar characters look as a baseline), but eventually quality will start to deteriorate without new high-quality data inputs.
What are they gonna do then when all the discussion boards where that data would originate are either gone or optimized into algorithmic metric farms like all the other social media sites?
[1]: https://old.reddit.com/user/Nathan2055
[2]: I can’t find it now, but there was an analysis about six months ago that showed that since the change a significant majority of the most popular posts in a given month seem to originate from /r/MadeMeSmile. Prior to the API change, this was spread over an enormous number of subreddits (albeit with a significant presence by the “defaults” just due to comparative subscriber counts). While I think the subreddit distribution has gotten better since then, it’s still mostly passive meme posts that hit the site-wide top pages since the switchover, which is indicative of broader trends.
Re: Gemini Robotics
#323There's one shot that stood out to me, right at the end of the main video, where the robot puts a round belt on a pulley: https://youtu.be/4MvGnmmP3c0?si=f9dOIbgq58EUz-PW&t=163 . Of course there are probably many examples of this exact action in its training data, but it felt very intuitive in a way the shirt-folding and object-sorting tasks in these demos usually don't. (Also there seems to be some kind of video aut…
The trick was in that the belt was too tight for an average human to put on with brute force, and disabling the tensioner or using tricks would require better than average mechanical skills their specially chosen 'random humans' lacked.
Re: Gemini Robotics
#324I'm a firmware engineer that's been working in consumer electronics and I feel very bleak about my future I feel so left behind. I have extremely limited robotics and computer vision experience. I have no ML experience. The only math I know has to do with basic signal processing. When I see open roles at these companies I think the projects I'm going to work on in the future will be more and more irrelevant to societ…
Re: Gemini Robotics
#325Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I'm just scared about a future where humans (say the next generation, kids 1-5 years of age right now) lack in-depth knowledge of almost everything and it's mostly AI writing low-level code, so there are no more "human experts." Isn’t that the ultimate goal?
It isn't. I mean, that depends on what "low level code" means. We have compilers so, to an extent, it's something desirable. But if "low level code" means everything we understand as code today, it may not be great. Human languages aren't precise enough for the kind of work that needs to be done. But let's say it's accomplished. What will end up happening is that AI (should it work to the extent it's been hyper) will…
We'll probably spend all day consuming media and socializing. Thats the optimistic view of course.
Re: Gemini Robotics
#326Earlier quoted context omitted.
At least you're honest. I feel a lot of people (on HN esp) take pride in their programming ability and intelligence to the extent that they think there's no chance AI will take over their job. LLMs were a breakthough out of like a multitude of breakthroughs in AI in the past decade. I think there only needs to be a couple more breakthroughs in the next decade for it to come full circle. Whenever I here a naysayer ope…
When I see pro-AI promoters giving weird analogies that do not fit, I get a feeling that they are either management class(aka MBA types) or are not serious professionals. One key point we must first understand, coding is NOT software engineering or even programming! Writing code is the last bit, a minimal fraction of the job description(unless you are actually indie dev or working for consulting firms). The core task…
Re: Gemini Robotics
#327The upshot of this is that anyone will be able to order a couple of robot arms from China and then set them up in a garage, programming them with just text, like we do with LLMs now. Time to think bigger.
Re: Gemini Robotics
#328Re: Gemini Robotics
#329If this makes it easier and faster to sort garbage, we could probably improve the efficiency of recycling 100x. I know there are some places that do that already, but there are so many menial tasks that could be done by robots to improve the world.
Folks in the industry are certainly thinking about this. The economic forces at play could be huge.
Re: Gemini Robotics
#330Earlier quoted context omitted.
Google uses their insane ad revenue to subsidize the Xerox Parc / Bell Labs of the current generation. Waymo, DeepMind, Gemini Robotics. They're killing it and leading the entire market. It's not just researchers. Engineers at Google get to spin up products and throw spaghetti at walls, too. Google has more money than God to throw around. Google's ad dominance will probably never go away unless antitrust action by th…
Google has been looking for post-ad post-search revenue for almost a decade now. They certainly won't dominate forever and have several signals flashing red for a few years now.
With a reasonable degree of success. In their last quarter (see https://abc.xyz/investor/earnings/) 25% of their revenue was non-ads, and that percentage has been consistently increasing.