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US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

ukrainetoday.org

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Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#121

Post by sovietmudkipz »

postingawayonhn wrote: post #54
sovietmudkipz wrote: post #39

I genuinely wish there was an understandable endgame for the USA. The USA seems to be throwing its weight around but I’m not entirely sure to what end. This headline/article is just one area where the US is behaving perplexingly. I understand that Trump wants Zelenskyy to sign the minerals deal and that implicitly there’s security guarantees. Fine there’s at least a through line. However; by demonstrating that the US…

NATO as has existed is already over. Nobody has any faith that the US will follow through on its Article 5 obligations.

If that’s the case that “NATO as has existed is already over” then maybe it is wise for the USA to pull out. Maybe that’s the endgame for Europe? Europe defends Europe (or gets taken over by Russia I guess), and USA isn’t on the hook for its defense anymore.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#122

Post by darthrupert »

jopsen wrote: post #109
realo wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Donald wants Groenland ... After that, why not Denmark itself ?

> After that, why not Denmark itself ? Hmm, the US welcome to liberate us from sour tax burden. I suspect the invading force will surrender when they see the liabilities :)

Trump probably is planning to cash in by raping the country of its mineral and oil wealth.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#123

Post by darthrupert »

sras-me wrote: post #58
jameskilton wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trump doesn't care about anyone but himself. The only reason he ran for president again (a job he absolutely hated the first time around) was so he would stay out of jail for the myriad of crimes he committed. Now that he actually got reelected (us Americans can be incredibly dumb) he's doing everything he can to punish everyone he deems was "out to get him". Also he adores Putin and Xi and is doing what he can to be…

[flagged]

Yes, the easiest because it was the only way.

It worked, didn't it? Every prosecutor just quit soon after Trump was elected.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#124

Post by sovietmudkipz »

throwaway_20357 wrote: post #79
sovietmudkipz wrote: post #39

I genuinely wish there was an understandable endgame for the USA. The USA seems to be throwing its weight around but I’m not entirely sure to what end. This headline/article is just one area where the US is behaving perplexingly. I understand that Trump wants Zelenskyy to sign the minerals deal and that implicitly there’s security guarantees. Fine there’s at least a through line. However; by demonstrating that the US…

> I understand that Trump wants Zelenskyy to sign the minerals deal and that implicitly there’s security guarantees. I don't think there are any "security guarantees". What could they be? The "endgame" as far as I understand it: The US wants access to the minerals as a compensation for the money already spent and, perhaps, to restore some of the support currently put on hold (satellite data access). Once the Ukranian…

I think the implicit guarantee is if American business and workers are harvesting minerals then if Russia attacked the USA would have even more incentive to intervene militarily.

That said, I don’t know what more Ukraine would want given the Budapest Memorandum already ties the USA, UK, and Russia to Ukraine’s defense. That’s proven to be a mixed success, as both USA, UK, and other countries have indeed stepped up for Ukraine’s defense.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#125

Post by rich_sasha »

bborud wrote: post #15
eunos wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Especially F-35 where lack of American support means total brick. Hey, at least Ukraine can use their S-300 systems and Sukhois against their maker.

This is top of mind for all European countries that bought the F-35. They are painfully aware of this. So is the US defense industry which will notice softening sales kicking in a few years down the line as European countries are less inclined to buy US arms. This was predictable though. The markets have already rewarded those who saw this coming.

I wonder if we'll see a coordinated wave of F-35 cancellations. They must all be aware they are potentially buying bricks. The time to do it, thus, is now - the situation isn't improving while time and money are wasted. But that's an enormous political escalation.

Or maybe Europeans, as "founding members", are able to support the planes on their own? I doubt it though. The engine alone is US made, ans that alone is probably unmaintainable without their support.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#128

Post by tim333 »

I'm wondering if the deal with Trump and Russia is just favours like they find investors for his questionable businesses and he helps them or if they do have kompromat? Apparently in the days they were entertaining him in Moscow it was quite common to provide hookers and film things and given Trump's character it may not have been that hard to get him to go along. He always looks rather embarrassed with Putin.

Also it could explain this stuff which is hard otherwise.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#129

Post by tim333 »

postingawayonhn wrote: post #54
sovietmudkipz wrote: post #39

I genuinely wish there was an understandable endgame for the USA. The USA seems to be throwing its weight around but I’m not entirely sure to what end. This headline/article is just one area where the US is behaving perplexingly. I understand that Trump wants Zelenskyy to sign the minerals deal and that implicitly there’s security guarantees. Fine there’s at least a through line. However; by demonstrating that the US…

NATO as has existed is already over. Nobody has any faith that the US will follow through on its Article 5 obligations.

I'd say it's on hold for four years till they get a new president. In the meanwhile I guess the other members will have to try to manage.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#130

Post by lukashoff »

hdjjhhvvhga wrote: post #95
sras-me wrote: post #50

[flagged]

> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzgPJeYZaOU The second video repeats the same argument: the "NATO's eastward march". Putin says Russia had to start the war in Ukraine to stop NATO from expanding too close (he failed as two more countries joined NATO). But when you dig one "why?" deeper you can understand that NATO is not a self-aware entity that expands and threats, it's an alliance of countries that realize that i…

> Who knows what's in their heads

Expansion, colonization, power and wealth. Classic

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