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Jeep owners fed up with in-car pop-up ads

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Re: Jeep owners fed up with in-car pop-up ads

#231

Post by Ancapistani »

pseudalopex wrote: post #193
kolanos wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Other countries like the Netherlands went through the same car-centric design phase and realized it was too expensive and bad for the country so they reverted. We can and should keep cars, but our reliance on them for our very existence is quite fragile and unnecessary. The Netherlands is roughly the size of Maryland. If The Netherlands was a U.S. state, it would be 42nd in terms of land area.

> The Netherlands is roughly the size of Maryland. How is this relevant in your mind? Do you imagine most Americans crossing entire states in their daily commute? Do you imagine people and goods do not cross European borders?

> Do you imagine most Americans crossing entire states in their daily commute?

The size of Maryland? Yes, I do. Not likely "most Americans", but a much larger portion than you'd suspect.

My commute was ~30 miles for over a decade, back before I went remote. That was considered "local". From 2016-2017, my commute was ~80 miles.

All of the above are one-way distances, and they're not at all exceptional in the US. Yes, the size of the Netherlands relative to the US is definitely relevant to this discussion.

Re: Jeep owners fed up with in-car pop-up ads

#232

Post by matty22 »

spudlyo wrote: post #6

You wouldn't run an ad blocker on your car... > But the problem could presage a more significant issue for future drivers. Last year, Ford filed a patent for an in-car advertising system that would use the car’s speakers and display screen to serve ads to drivers and passengers. That system would also use the car’s GPS tracker to serve ads relevant to the driver’s route. This is some Black Mirror type dystopian visio…

Sceptre make great dumb TVs. Had one for years and have no complaints aside from the sound isn't great. But tack on a sound bar and it's been maybe my favorite TV I've ever owned.

https://www.sceptre.com/TV/4K-UHD-TV-category1category73.htm...

Re: Jeep owners fed up with in-car pop-up ads

#233

Post by Ancapistani »

jmward01 wrote: post #187
potato3732842 wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not only will "they" fight you but even here on a place literally called Hacker News will people screech about how you shouldn't be able to run your own software on your own car because of safety implications or whatever

There are places where it makes sense that only audited software should be allowed, but the big touch-screen in the middle of the vehicle isn't one of them. That shouldn't have access to safety related systems (other than reporting) so there shouldn't be a safety concern with wiping it and putting what I want on it.

> That shouldn't have access to safety related systems (other than reporting) so there shouldn't be a safety concern with wiping it and putting what I want on it.

It does, though.

My wife drive a 2019 F-150 Platinum. The only way to change the behavior of at least half of the features of that vehicle is through the infotainment system.

My understanding is that it's actually running a Linux kernel under the hood - literally in this case! - but it's not exactly an open and well-documented system.

Re: Jeep owners fed up with in-car pop-up ads

#234

Post by Ancapistani »

karaterobot wrote: post #13
ypeterholmes wrote: post #2

Advertising has gotten out of control. What's bizarre to me is that the people violating us are literally the ones who want something from us. Is there no way to boycott anyone advertising in our car? AND the car itself of course.

I didn't buy a Jeep because of stuff like this. The problem is that when I looked at the competitors, for instance the Bronco, they had their own little UI annoyances too. There wasn't anything on the market that didn't annoy or insult me in one way or another, so I ended up just buying a 25 year old Ranger. The irony is that 25 years ago, I had a Ranger like the one I own now, and it took me a series of seven modern…

This is why I drive a 2000 Jeep Wrangler, while my wife is in a 2019 F-150 and my oldest daughter is in a 2024 Subaru Crosstrek - I wanted simple, easy to repair, and no frills. They wanted comfortable and capable.

I admit I steal their vehicles sometimes in the dead of winter. Mine has no working heater. Unless it's under 20ºF or so, I don't even bother to put the hard top on it.

I've had my Jeep for 15 years now, and am starting to feel the itch for a new vehicle. I have my eye on a 1992 GMC pickup. It belonged to my grandfather who passed away in ~2005 and has been stored in a garage since then. I've put about $4k into it getting it roadworthy again after sitting for that long, but it's only got 15k miles on it and the interior is mint. If I bother with it, it needs the paint buffed a re-coated on one side that was partially in the sun where it was stored - at which point it will effectively be a brand new vehicle.

I'm looking forward to that big carburated V8 after a decade and a half driving a 2.5L i4 :)

Re: Jeep owners fed up with in-car pop-up ads

#235

Post by npongratz »

smackeyacky wrote: post #225
28304283409234 wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting whatsboutism you have there.

Is it wrong though? Gen X here, everything we ever watched had ads in it or near it

I see two major differences to the mass advertising of yesteryear (which, similar to you, I have also lived through):

1) The psychological manipulation inherent to all advertising has shifted from diluted, mass manipulation to pinpoint-accurate, targeted manipulation right down to the individual level, with impunity via plausible deniability.

2) Advertising is a major distributor of malware, with the ability to target anything with a chip.

Given either one of the above, I absolutely cannot trust any advertising delivered via modern technology. Since we have to contend with both issues, I view modern advertising as one of greatest threats to my mental health and individual sovereignty that exists in my day-to-day life.

Re: Jeep owners fed up with in-car pop-up ads

#236

Post by tim333 »

spicybright wrote: post #84
ericmay wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Car-only infrastructure which is pervasive in America is a liability to the country and the economy. I can just not buy a TV and my life is great. Probably better. I can't not buy a car except in a few select locations if I want to participate in the economy. That's both dangerous and fragile.

People aren't going to stop using cars because of ads, they're just going to put up with almost anything because they have to in order to survive. The car industry is probably one of the most stable economic pillars the US has.

>they're just going to put up with...

I certainly don't plan to. You can always chose a different car. I doubt the Jeep users will put up with it for long.

Re: Jeep owners fed up with in-car pop-up ads

#237

Post by ericmay »

Ancapistani wrote: post #231
pseudalopex wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The Netherlands is roughly the size of Maryland. How is this relevant in your mind? Do you imagine most Americans crossing entire states in their daily commute? Do you imagine people and goods do not cross European borders?

> Do you imagine most Americans crossing entire states in their daily commute? The size of Maryland? Yes, I do. Not likely "most Americans", but a much larger portion than you'd suspect. My commute was ~30 miles for over a decade, back before I went remote. That was considered "local". From 2016-2017, my commute was ~80 miles. All of the above are one-way distances, and they're not at all exceptional in the US. Yes,…

I live in Columbus, Ohio with a current population roughly of 2.5 million, which is about 13% of the entire population of the Netherlands, and that's within 30 miles or less. That's not an atypical American city. In fact there are three of them in Ohio alone.

Within Columbus we have a few buses and that's it for transit, unfortunately - though we are working on building new bike lanes and reforming our zoning code to allow more dense development within the city and hopefully throughout the region too. Nothing but good comes from this and makes us wealthier as a city.

Most people living in Columbus who do commute to some job site, do so within 30 miles or less, and in cases where they commute longer than that it's because they actively choose to live quite far away from their workplace. We also have a large portion of the population (children, elderly, etc.) who do not have to make a daily commute like what we are discussing here, but instead do their daily activities locally.

What's important to note here is that there are no options - we affirmatively mandate that citizens purchase a car and incur all of the associated expenses in order to participate in daily life, whether that's going to church, the farmer's market, to a friend's house, or to the park.

In one area of Columbus I've routinely seen with my own eyes kids crossing 5 lanes of 45mph + traffic to get from one apartment complex to the housing development across the roadway. This is taken as normal. It's not. It's fucking stupid.

> My commute was ~30 miles for over a decade, back before I went remote. That was considered "local". From 2016-2017, my commute was ~80 miles.

Maybe that's a bad, and incredibly expensive design we should stop subsidizing? I'm not sure why we should focus on these edge cases, and they are indeed edge cases, when we can spend money more effectively to move more people more efficiently around our cities. If you want to live 80 miles away from your job more power to you, but I don't think everyone else should have to pay for it.

Re: Jeep owners fed up with in-car pop-up ads

#238

Post by averageRoyalty »

spudlyo wrote: post #6

You wouldn't run an ad blocker on your car... > But the problem could presage a more significant issue for future drivers. Last year, Ford filed a patent for an in-car advertising system that would use the car’s speakers and display screen to serve ads to drivers and passengers. That system would also use the car’s GPS tracker to serve ads relevant to the driver’s route. This is some Black Mirror type dystopian visio…

In fact there is a specific Black Mirror episode which covers this, S01E2 "Fifteen Million Merits", in which the protagonist is forced to watch advertising in his room where the walls a ceiling are screens. Closing his eyes triggers an alarm, and he must pay to dismiss the ads.

Re: Jeep owners fed up with in-car pop-up ads

#239

Post by consteval »

Ancapistani wrote: post #231
pseudalopex wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The Netherlands is roughly the size of Maryland. How is this relevant in your mind? Do you imagine most Americans crossing entire states in their daily commute? Do you imagine people and goods do not cross European borders?

> Do you imagine most Americans crossing entire states in their daily commute? The size of Maryland? Yes, I do. Not likely "most Americans", but a much larger portion than you'd suspect. My commute was ~30 miles for over a decade, back before I went remote. That was considered "local". From 2016-2017, my commute was ~80 miles. All of the above are one-way distances, and they're not at all exceptional in the US. Yes,…

This is because of car-centric suburbs first infrastructure, not in spite of it.

Re: Jeep owners fed up with in-car pop-up ads

#240

Post by kolanos »

rstuart4133 wrote: post #224
kolanos wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is considerably easier for a country that would be equivalent to one of the smallest U.S. states to abandon their dependence on cars than it is a country 237 times larger. Furthermore, the further west you go in theU.S. the more spread out things get until you reach the west coast. To the east of where I live there is a highway that is 287 miles long and is almost devoid of any services whatsoever, no civilization…

> It is considerably easier for a country that would be equivalent to one of the smallest U.S. states to abandon their dependence on cars than it is a country 237 times larger. I'm not sure it is. Have you visited the Netherlands? You don't walk or ride a push bike between cities there, any more than you do in the USA. Bicycles are the predominant form of transport because of how they design their suburbs. A car in s…

> Doesn't the word "lonely" give you a hint on why this is irrelevant? You aren't going to ride a push bike to pick up fuel for your tractor in the Netherlands either.

The relevance isn't that it is lonely, the relevance is that it is not unique west of the Mississippi. But I welcome you to point me to a country the size of the United States that has solved this problem. I think you'll find they come in two varieties, either they're as spread out as the United States or the entire population is almost entirely against a coast/border wit much of the rest of the country remaining mostly empty.

> It's the USA's sprawling suburbs that weld you to your car's, not your cities or your rural expanses. It's true that's hard to change now. But there is no reason it had to be that way. Your suburbs could have been as compact as those in the Netherlands. The Netherlands made a conscious choice not to do it that way (they built free ways, decided they didn't like them, and turned them into canals ). I'm not sure how the USA arrived at their current arrangement but it wasn't because you "had to".

Western expansion in the United States was a deadly affair prior to railroads and highways. The Netherlands was largely already a developed country when they did all of what you describe. Much of the United States today lives and dies by what little transportation options they have. There is a reason there are over 3,000 ghost towns scattered across the United States west of the Mississippi and it is not because of the sprawling suburbs. When you have one major highway in or out, city planning kind of takes a backseat.

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