Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Federal workers ordered to return to offices without desks, Wi-Fi and lights

cnn.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

281–290 of 380 posts

Re: Federal workers ordered to return to offices without desks, Wi-Fi and lights

#281

Post by onlyrealcuzzo »

stvltvs wrote: post #232
everdrive wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm starting to think the "government is inefficient" folks have never actually worked in any corporate job. I've worked in two companies since I left the federal government 5-10 years ago, and both were significantly less efficient, and less effective than the federal agency I worked for. I'm sure that's not _always_ true, but it just seems like any large organization full of people is difficult to keep efficient.

Same experience. The "government = inefficient" propaganda has been repeated ad infinitum for decades so that now it feels like a law of nature to people. My experience is however that every large org is inefficient in its own unique way, no matter which sector.

It's parroted by people who see the government as "inefficient" at generating profit, not as inefficient at providing a service.

Why should plebs be entitled to clean water without an 80% margin?

Re: Federal workers ordered to return to offices without desks, Wi-Fi and lights

#282

Post by ryandrake »

jofla_net wrote: post #264
Aurornis wrote: post #35

> “The only thing a return to the office has given me is an hour of traffic while driving and a loss in efficiency,” said the worker, who requested anonymity for fear of job reprisals. RTO in a nutshell. As someone who chose my living location based on where my family wants to live first and jobs second, this sudden turn to RTO mandates is infinitely depressing. Most of my work involves talking to people in different…

Don't want to be the cynical guy, but having talked to just such a ceo who gets-off by being hired to fire people. RTO is literally a badge, or at least an excuse to exercise authority. Often yes, to get rid of free loaders, but more specifically to shove it in the face of a lot of engineers that they are subservient. This guy actually would put it that they saw a gig as, and I'm recalling, a place to 'eat shit', unt…

I think a lot of executives see engineers as uppity, well-paid factory workers, and absolutely hate that the gap between their own pay and engineering's pay is so small. In order to maintain their world view that they are better, higher-class people, they need to be making 10X-100X what their median worker makes and they need their median worker to be afraid for their jobs and subservient to them. Current software engineering comp. (and until recently, the ease of engineers to job hop) contradicts this world view. The last thing they want is to be seen as [ugh] PEERS to regular workers. That won't do at all. Workers need to be taken down a notch and shown their place on the totem pole.

Re: Federal workers ordered to return to offices without desks, Wi-Fi and lights

#283

Post by abeppu »

mirekrusin wrote: post #249
abeppu wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, it's a valuable lesson that, though it may become a nazi cesspit and vastly more annoying to interact with, an organization can survive for a surprisingly long time as a shambolic remnant of its former self, doing less and less well for fewer people. As I understand it: - twitter became less appealing to advertisers so revenue dropped - you can't really firmly track the valuation over time after it was delisted…

It still works last time I checked – with fraction of headcount and with people working from the office. Twitter had few months runway until it'd run out of money and go bankrupt. Bloomberg analysis says (despite advertisers and communities leave etc) platform earnings seem to be staying at $1.2 billion a year. Reports from Feb 2025 say that X doubled its adjusted EBITDA (earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation…

Your argument seems to be entirely financial rather than what twitter _does_. My understanding is their MAUs and DAUs have fallen. Fewer people are looking at it or posting on it, less often.

https://soax.com/research/twitter-active-users https://mashable.com/article/twitter-x-daily-active-users-dr...

I think it's interesting that you mention bloomberg as saying that things are going ok. My recent read was that they thought twitter was just messing with numbers.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2025-02-20/behind-mu...

Key quotes:

> its improved fortunes owe much to heavily adjusted financials and investors’ fear of missing out

> The 2024 figures weren’t audited, but the 2023 figures were, said one of the people. None of them would qualify for generally accepted accounting principles, also known as the GAAP standard that the US Securities and Exchange Commission requires for publicly traded companies.

... i.e. the recent numbers aren't trustworthy

> Even under those unusual calculations, X’s debt burden was roughly nine times adjusted earnings — far beyond the baseline of six that bank regulators characterize as risky.

> The threat of litigation — and Musk’s advisory role to Trump — has been a topic of conversation among some advertisers as they decide whether to return, according to several ad industry sources. While few believe X’s product or ad offerings have improved in the past year, marketers are weighing the possible downside of ignoring X and what that might mean in terms of retaliation from Musk.

... i.e. to the extent that some advertisers have returned, it's b/c they think they'll be punished if they don't, not because it's a good way of reaching an audience or promoting their brand.

I think the actual revenue story is worse than the usage story. My first searches show that their Q4 revenue was $2.5B, roughly half of where it was in 2021.

https://www.businessofapps.com/data/twitter-statistics/

Analogously, I don't think any of the recent sudden moves mean that the federal government at large is _over_ ("doomsday scenario") except for the departments that the administration actually wants to kill, but I think the current administration is setting the government up to do less and less well. Possibly it will be a great financial outcome for Musk.

(edited to add missing bloomberg link)

Re: Federal workers ordered to return to offices without desks, Wi-Fi and lights

#285

Post by alabastervlog »

dartos wrote: post #275
realo wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which people? I hear that it is the same people who voted Donald last time who voted Donald again this time. No others voted for him. The issue seems to be that many people who are not trumpists did not vote at all. Maybe i'm wrong, but it seems that if everyone who could vote actually did vote, then Donald would have lost. So ... maybe he won, but i hardly think he represents the majority is US citizens.

> Which people? The 51% of voters that voted for him… (correction: 49.8%) > I hear that it is the same people who voted Donald last time who voted Donald again this time. No others voted for him. This is wrong. There were more republican voters this time around than last time. > The issue seems to be that many people who are not trumpists did not vote at all. Maybe i'm wrong, but it seems that if everyone who could v…

> The 51% of voters that voted for him…

Nitpick: 49.8%

Re: Federal workers ordered to return to offices without desks, Wi-Fi and lights

#286

Post by 16mb »

onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #223
xyst wrote: post #173

The power dynamic between labor and capital (or managers in this case) in the US has shifted so much since our grandparents generation. It’s hard to ignore it now. Our rights and safety nets have been stripped away. 40+ years of trickle down economics and other failed neoclassical/neoliberal economic theory have directly caused the situation we are in.

Are you seriously making an argument that workers have worse conditions now than in the 60s? Feel free to make an argument that we are moving in the wrong direction NOW, but not that we have moved in the wrong direction entirely since the 60s.

40 years ago would be after 1985.

Re: Federal workers ordered to return to offices without desks, Wi-Fi and lights

#287

Post by ffsm8 »

no_wizard wrote: post #270
gloosx wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You assume that continuous combat deployments automatically translate to full-scale war readiness, but there's a big difference between counterinsurgency operations and peer-to-peer warfare. The US military has been engaged in conflicts for decades, but most of them involved fighting non-state actors or weaker conventional forces, not a high-intensity war against an advanced military.

Advanced is doing some heavy lifting. The US military is far a cut above everything else, in terms of tactical readiness, sheer firepower and especially effective size. We outspend any other nation - China included of which we spend an estimated 2.5 times more than - and we have been in that lead position for decades, not just years. While yes, US forces haven’t squared off against conventional militaries of any note…

I agree with the spirit of your statement, I truly believe that the US military is the by far most advanced and well equipped force on earth.

Nonetheless, I feel the need to point out that it's budget is a terrible indicator for that.

I'm not even american and have heard just how massively overcharged everything is that's sold to the US military.

It's entirely possible that i.e. China, that can produce their military equipment could actually be way better equipped then it's budget implies. I don't think that Chinas military has caught up to the US yet, but the military spending feels like a bad comparison considering how differently they're financed.

Re: Federal workers ordered to return to offices without desks, Wi-Fi and lights

#288

Post by alabastervlog »

red020 wrote: post #255
sjsdaiuasgdia wrote: post #2

The disruption is (part of) the point. Degrading the ability of government employees to do their jobs leads to greater inefficiency and more failure, which can then be pointed at to validate assertions that government isn't efficient and produces bad outcomes.

[dead]

I'm not seeing that in either the deportation/removal rates, nor the encounters rate. Which time period 2021-2024 should I be looking at to see this? I'm looking only at annual rates, not month by month.

Re: Federal workers ordered to return to offices without desks, Wi-Fi and lights

#289

Post by VBprogrammer »

3D30497420 wrote: post #239
gloosx wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Russia has no military advantage against ours Recent battle experience is kind of an advantage. Russia is running a full-scale war against US and NATO weaponry in Ukraine for three years, studying it and refining its tactics. What was the last battle for USA? Houthis in Yemen? Few airstrikes and limited engagements. It is very naive to believe Putin doesn’t want to cripple the US economy or that war is not a real th…

It would probably depend a lot on the type of conflict. The US would almost certainly have air-superiority, which would have a significant difference. Of course, air-superiority didn't "win" the US wars in Afghanistan or Iraq, but those were more guerilla-style wars with a somewhat (at least) hostile larger population. A US-Russia conflict would probably look pretty different. Or it would just go nuclear, in which ca…

I think you have to be careful about assuming the US would have air superiority. It doesn't take a lot for what, on paper, looks like a superior air force to turn out to be not fit for purpose.

The famous example is the F4 Phantom getting beat in dogfights against the Mig 21 in Vietnam. It was mostly solved by changing the tactics and to improvements to later model aircraft.

Obviously dogfights aren't realistic in the modern age but that is just one of many variables which might lead to an unexpected deficit. Robustness, reliability, repairability, availablity of parts, ability to operate out of unimproved airfields, using poor qualify fuels etc.

Re: Federal workers ordered to return to offices without desks, Wi-Fi and lights

#290

Post by [deleted] »

3D30497420 wrote: post #239
gloosx wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Russia has no military advantage against ours Recent battle experience is kind of an advantage. Russia is running a full-scale war against US and NATO weaponry in Ukraine for three years, studying it and refining its tactics. What was the last battle for USA? Houthis in Yemen? Few airstrikes and limited engagements. It is very naive to believe Putin doesn’t want to cripple the US economy or that war is not a real th…

It would probably depend a lot on the type of conflict. The US would almost certainly have air-superiority, which would have a significant difference. Of course, air-superiority didn't "win" the US wars in Afghanistan or Iraq, but those were more guerilla-style wars with a somewhat (at least) hostile larger population. A US-Russia conflict would probably look pretty different. Or it would just go nuclear, in which ca…

[deleted]
Post reply on HN