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China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

wsj.com

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Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#141

Post by landryraccoon »

Nevermark wrote: post #117
gunian wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

don't believe everything the slavers tell you :) if everyone had a way to completely disintegrate the planet no one would be above another

All we need is nukes? I think you might be counting on way too many decision makers to remain rational and wise enough to avoid and defuse non-trivial situations that want to escalate. In the 8 billion times 8 billion potential nuclear exchanges that universal nuke would enable (64 quadrillion!), there is at least one scary bad one. At any time of day. That you are standing too near. Please acknowledge my wisdom here…

Sounds like a very strong incentive for us to find a way to leave the planet and settle elsewhere.

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#142

Post by Philpax »

iammrpayments wrote: post #30

Is what they call “AI” actually dangerous or is just some common misconception about how powerful language models imply skynet taking over the world?

The end goal is something capable of human-level intelligence in most, if not all, fields, and from there, it's not that difficult to continue scaling it up across speed / scale (and perhaps intelligence.)

See Dario Amodei's Machines of Loving Grace: https://darioamodei.com/machines-of-loving-grace

It doesn't take much imagination to think about how this could end poorly if it goes wrong or is controlled by the wrong party.

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#143

Post by tehjoker »

blackeyeblitzar wrote: post #48

Why does the US still allow Chinese nationals to study at its universities and work at its companies? Seems like a big risk that cutting edge research and trade secrets will go to America’s main adversary. Industrial espionage by China has a long history, and China has more valuable things to steal from America than the other way.

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Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#144

Post by sepositus »

scrollaway wrote: post #38
NalNezumi wrote: post #36

I wonder if given the recent "moral" loss of US, we will see a post-WW2 Soviet vs USA style defection of scientists & engineers between USA and China? When you read the reasoning of people that defected from UK/US to soviet with nuclear secrets it's kinda hard to grasp now, but back then I can definitely understand that a mix of "the soviets are not that bad" and "are we really that good?" could've made people switch…

As an EU-based employer, I'm seeing a post-WW2 soviet vs usa style defection of engineers between USA and Europe. By the way, if anyone US-based is in this situation and wants to "defect" to an EU-job, send me a message, I can help you.

Funny, I’m literally seeing the opposite. Had two people move from the EU last year due to free speech concerns.

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#145

Post by CamperBob2 »

77pt77 wrote: post #138
kasey_junk wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have the test case for this. When one power had nukes and no one else did they weren’t used…

They were on Japan and plenty of people pushed for a preemptive strike on the USSR. "John von Neumann" was a very famous and influential person defending just that.

Smart guy, von Neumann. We should've listened to him.

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#146

Post by Philpax »

IAmGraydon wrote: post #21

It seems a bit strange. This isn’t like nuclear weapons researchers in the 1940s, where only a small group had the knowledge to build the bomb. There are a LOT of AI researchers out there, and it’s more a battle of resources rather than rare knowledge at this point, it seems.

There are many researchers, but a limited number with the ability to make the revolutionary leaps necessary. To take your analogy: there were many physicists who knew an atomic bomb was possible, and many who even attempted it, but the Manhattan Project was the first to succeed through a combination of the right people and the right resources.

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#147

Post by t2j434j2l43j34 »

Ah, how the tables turn.

In fairness though - this will happen. China/Russia etc. might claim they have secret "social glue" (Dugin has a whole philosophy on this), but liberalism and ergo US is still the top-dog because Communism has destroyed the "old" social-glue (Orthodox Xtianity and Buddhism/Confucianism) already. India is even worse (and likely unsaveable) because in addition to all this, the elites don't even the glue of the language (and largely identify as pan-Anglo nationalists).

US (w/ smaller allies like Japan/Korea) still largely set the social "ontology" across the world (and also why China will run into the same traps and pathologies that Japan/Korea/India and other Asian states have gotten stuck in). I doubt Robotics/AI would save them anymore than it did Japan.

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#148

Post by Philpax »

smeeger wrote: post #54

it only becomes more obvious that AI is being treated as an arms race. thats why the federal government assassinated suchir balaji.

The latest autopsy came down pretty firmly on it being a suicide. Even if it could've been an assassination, there isn't much motive: his claims were about copyright violation, which neither OpenAI or the government would much care about in an arms race.

Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#149

Post by suraci »

germandiago wrote: post #6
A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #3

> They also worry that executives could be detained and used as a bargaining chip in U.S.-China negotiations, in an echo of a fight over a Huawei executive held in Canada at Washington’s request during the first Trump administration. Does anybody doubt that this is a reasonable concern? The Feds would probably throw the book at those guys for every form of IP theft, "conspiracy to commit economic espionage," "theft o…

I often say states behave as mafias. It is a matter of becoming influential enough so that they treat you as a criminal. In the meantime, the streets every day less and less safe, at least in Europe, bc of real criminals, the ones that kill or systematically steal even in organized crime and they do very little about it.

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Re: China tells its AI leaders to avoid U.S. travel over security concerns

#150

Post by georgemcbay »

blindriver wrote: post #68

I worked at a well-known company that told us we couldn't bring any work electronic devices to China, because there was a risk malware could be installed on it. They advised us not to bring any personal electronic devices either, like phones because they could be confiscated at the border and returned with malware installed on it. It makes sense that this happens. I'm curious why they haven't attempted to tighten the…

> I'm curious why they haven't attempted to tighten the screws on Tesla since Elon's position has weakened and they can really put him in a bad spot if they force him to give up something to them.

Its possible they believe he will destroy Tesla left to his own devices and their best course of action is to sit back and let it happen naturally with no meddling exposure for themselves and then maybe they can even poach some of his employees in the aftermath.

Considering that the administration Elon is gleefully making himself the "chainsaw" figurehead for is actively working to cripple the EV market in the US, this doesn't seem like a bad plan to me.

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