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DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

nytimes.com

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Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#921

Post by undersuit »

drawkward wrote: post #877
alienthrowaway wrote: post #381

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The "Fuck you, I got mine" mentality and short-termism has been festering for decades at many American institutions, such as for-profit companies. Openly selling the country short for personal benefit is just one small step after many hundreds of them to get where we are.

>The "Fuck you, I got mine" mentality and short-termism has been festering for decades ...in American culture

Which we export across the world. When we open up a widget factory in your non-US town it seeps in and takes hold.

Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#922

Post by dmix »

nullstyle wrote: post #671
dmix wrote: post #648

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s still worth looking and finding that stuff out (carefully and transparently). There’s only been token attempts at a meta analysis of gov efficiency in the past. GWB created a small version of DOGE with almost the same mandate that never really did anything notable because it was small and never ambitious (it also still exists https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Council_of_the_Inspectors_Gene... ). Most large wasteful…

> There’s only been token attempts at a meta analysis of gov efficiency in the past. Citation needed. The OMB has been around for a while.

It’s partly true OBM saved $25 billion once a decade ago in 2014 when they proposed 215 cuts https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/omb/Building_a_21st_Cen...

But those big wins were rare. It’s mostly small stuff like during Biden admin they banned single use plastic and reducing food waste. No one has ever really done large scale data analysis on spending and made it a major priority across the federal government in recent history.

Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#923

Post by dmix »

rat87 wrote: post #706
dmix wrote: post #648

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s still worth looking and finding that stuff out (carefully and transparently). There’s only been token attempts at a meta analysis of gov efficiency in the past. GWB created a small version of DOGE with almost the same mandate that never really did anything notable because it was small and never ambitious (it also still exists https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Council_of_the_Inspectors_Gene... ). Most large wasteful…

Trump has also attacked parts of the goverment doing anaylsis/oversight of the budget as well as hobbling prosecution of corrupt politicans

Yes DOGE would be much better as an independent agency created by Congress with all the controls that comes with it. It’s inherently a bit toothless as an executive advisory council without further increasing executive power which is dangerous.

Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#924

Post by corimaith »

refurb wrote: post #674
mandmandam wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Americans cheered for the gutting of USAID because they thought that spending 25% of the federal budget was too much, and should be around 10% instead. The actual spend on foreign aid? Under 1%. Americans are systemically and catastrophically disinformed. Expecting us to be able to assess the real impact of the DOGE team's fuckups is a violation of GIGO.

USAID is not "international aid". It's an arm of the CIA that uses "international development" as a cover for it's activities. Look at the role of USAID during the Vietnam War under CORDS. It funded the "strategic hamlet" program which uprooted rural civilians into barb wire enclosures and provided arms and training to militia. That doesn't sound like international aid. Look at the Phoenix Program during the same war…

The two are not mutually exclusive, providing HIV assistance or maternal aid both is definitionally international aid while also furthering US interests. If you define international aid as purely unconditional or even counterproductive to self-interest then you'd be hard pressed to find any sort of example, nor would it be a definition I would think many agree with.

Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#925

Post by bitcoin_anon »

sxyuan wrote: post #248

For those who want to have a substantive discussion on the federal budget and believe these cuts are justified, I have a few questions (putting aside questions of constitutionality for this thread): 1. There are claims that federal spending is out of control. How do you square that with the fact that spending as a percentage of GDP is only slightly elevated compared to the historical average going back to at least th…

> 1. There are claims that federal spending is out of control. How do you square that with the fact that spending as a percentage of GDP is only slightly elevated compared to the historical average going back to at least the 1970s, with the main deviation in the past few years coming from the after-effects of the pandemic? [1]

Why do you choose 1970 as a baseline? Federal spending is absolutely out of control when compared to, say 1913, as a baseline.

“…a wise and frugal Government, which shall restrain men from injuring one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government, and this is necessary to close the circle of our felicities.”

- Thomas Jefferson

Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#926

Post by [deleted] »

InfiniteTitan wrote: post #909
presentation wrote: post #794

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think it’s about the budget at all. It’s just an excuse to purge the civil service, since it’s overwhelmingly liberals in it, so that they can swing it more republican. Deficits are just a cover.

> “since it’s overwhelmingly liberals in it” Source?

[deleted]

Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#927

Post by watersb »

presentation wrote: post #794
insane_dreamer wrote: post #550

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The proposed Senate budget includes $150 billion increase in the defense budget, which already was 50% of all discretionary spending (that means after SS and Medicare as that is covered by a separate tax). This is much more than any DOGE savings, and shows that this isn't about reducing the federal budget, but about cutting services in order to fund two things: military, and corporate tax cuts (which largely benefit…

I don’t think it’s about the budget at all. It’s just an excuse to purge the civil service, since it’s overwhelmingly liberals in it, so that they can swing it more republican. Deficits are just a cover.

Civil service work force is about 1/3 veteran - former military personnel.

https://www.fedweek.com/fedweek/share-of-veterans-in-federal...

While there is certainly a wide range of individual viewpoint in the military, compared to the general population I would not describe it as "overwhelmingly liberal".

.

There is evidence that DOGE has targeted Federal agencies perceived as "liberal":

https://www.zmescience.com/other/economics/ideological-purge...

Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#929

Post by ankwardat »

Sysreq2 wrote: post #230
munchler wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"We spend too much" is a political opinion, rather than a statement of fact. Only Congress can change the amount of money spent by the government, so the executive branch's actions are unconstitutional, no matter how large the crowd cheering it on. This is exactly the sort of mob rule that the Founders wanted to prevent.

I keep harping on this - but two points: 1) Our debt is above GDP and interest is rising faster than GDP growth. Debt is fine when being used as leverage but we are upside down at the moment. 2) We don’t have the ability to issue more debt at the moment. The government has no money. They are using employee pension funds to meet obligations with a promissory note. We have negative cash flow and have run out of the abi…

These are the biggest contributors to undoing Clinton's balanced budget in the 90's:

* Bush Jr Tax Cuts

* Useless Iraq war

* Too Big to Fail Bailouts of Banks

* Trumps tax cuts

* COVID spending

When billionaires and trillion-dollar corporations pay episilon to zero in taxes, maybe they should pay their share. Taxing the rich would solve the problem overnight.

Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#930

Post by ankwardat »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #716
Sysreq2 wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I keep harping on this - but two points: 1) Our debt is above GDP and interest is rising faster than GDP growth. Debt is fine when being used as leverage but we are upside down at the moment. 2) We don’t have the ability to issue more debt at the moment. The government has no money. They are using employee pension funds to meet obligations with a promissory note. We have negative cash flow and have run out of the abi…

> We don’t have the ability to issue more debt at the moment One, DOGE isn't doing anything to cut spending. Every dollar Musk "cuts" that doesn't get Congressional authorisation is just being borrowed from future litigation plus all the time and expense that will eat up. Two, if DOGE can supercede the Congress than so can the Treasury in issuing new debt. Trump has said he wants to kill the debt limit. He could just…

Musk is stealing data to use for his own gain, and installing back doors so he permanently has control over government. It will take decades to undo the spyware he's installing.
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