DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes • Hacker News Board

Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#701

Post by guax » Sun, Feb 23, 2025, 6:39 AM UTC

dustingetz wrote: post #462

bamboozled wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I love the narrative that some how “startups are efficient”. I’ve worked at 6 startups, they basically all failed due to “inefficiency”, burned through money before they made money or were acquired. I’ve worked for one major success story, and that was the most inefficient startup of all, they just had some luck and the founder was a great salesman. We literally hired morons at scale to appear bigger and more success…

absolutely startups can be inefficient but government projects are at a wholly different order of magnitude. Some startups will crush $20M and then die, and yet the best ones, such as facebook, return 100,000x ROI on that same $20 mil. Govt projects will crush $200M, deliver nothing and then go to recompete so another vendor can have a turn.

Meta spent how many billions on Metaverse and has what to show for it? Some argue it was wasteful.

Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#702

Post by rat87 » Sun, Feb 23, 2025, 6:42 AM UTC

curseofcasandra wrote: post #679

stogot wrote: post #604

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'd much rather my money being spent on education, foreign assistance, scientific research, etc., even if there is some inefficiencies and waste, than being spent on the military (which, by the way means that the big defense contractors in the US are _subsidized by tax payers_). We all would, but given that Russia, Iran, China, and NK are aggressive states and all actively claim that the US is the enemy, and that t…

[flagged]

Generally I think most american military/state department people dont want China as an enemy but see a high chance of conflict if they invade Taiwan. Though under Trump I'm not sure we would defend Taiwan, we seem to be betraying Ukraine and other european allies

Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#703

Post by guax » Sun, Feb 23, 2025, 6:42 AM UTC

mp05 wrote: post #649

_DeadFred_ wrote: post #632

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only meets HALF of the fascism warning signs you say? Nevermind then. Nothing to see here.

Surely there is some critical threshold that indicates that we can reject the hypothesis that fascism isn't happening?

No. Because If you say it's happening you violate #4.

Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#704

Post by scott_w » Sun, Feb 23, 2025, 6:44 AM UTC

insane_dreamer wrote: post #687

ipython wrote: post #644

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And don't worry, the House is ready to extend and expand tax cuts to more than extinguish any potential "savings" - to the tune of over $3 trillion in extra deficit spending. But don't worry, they've planned for that- just increase the debt limit by $4 trillion to cover the difference! After all, now that the Democrats aren't in charge any longer, increasing the debt limit is no biggie - we'll just grow ourselves out…

Wait, I thought the GOP was the party of fiscal conservatism and reducing the deficit? Shouldn't they be reducing the debt ceiling rather than raising it?

Like the Conservative Party in the UK, I’ve yet to see evidence of them actually reducing the spending deficit in my lifetime.

Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#705

Post by guax » Sun, Feb 23, 2025, 6:45 AM UTC

IAmGraydon wrote: post #588

_DeadFred_ wrote: post #521

Right in line with Umberto Eco's item 3 in his list of common features of fascism: "3. The cult of action for action’s sake. “Action being beautiful in itself, it must be taken before, or without, any previous reflection. Thinking is a form of emasculation.” https://www.openculture.com/2024/11/umberto-ecos-list-of-the...

Ok, but while I disagree with Musks actions, more than half of the 14 items don’t fit what’s currently happening.

I counted 3 that I would not apply, 2 can be argued. The rest is applicable just fine to what I see from the rethoric coming out of the US government.

Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#706

Post by rat87 » Sun, Feb 23, 2025, 6:46 AM UTC

dmix wrote: post #648

subharmonicon wrote: post #641

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But it is absolutely true that the federal government is endlessly wasteful; it’s insane watching everyone around me get gaslit into thinking the government is actually efficient. It's also absolutely true that private companies are endlessly wasteful. I've worked for four large companies now, and the waste is mind boggling. I think what upsets people about government is that tax dollars are used to fund it, but I…

It’s still worth looking and finding that stuff out (carefully and transparently). There’s only been token attempts at a meta analysis of gov efficiency in the past. GWB created a small version of DOGE with almost the same mandate that never really did anything notable because it was small and never ambitious (it also still exists https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Council_of_the_Inspectors_Gene... ). Most large wasteful…

Trump has also attacked parts of the goverment doing anaylsis/oversight of the budget as well as hobbling prosecution of corrupt politicans

Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#707

Post by isoprophlex » Sun, Feb 23, 2025, 6:49 AM UTC

MisterBastahrd wrote: post #437

qgin wrote: post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Number 3 can’t be overstated. Healthcare costs for the exact same care are 2x-3x what they are in Europe. Global health insurance plans usually come in two flavors: 1. Global coverage 2. Global coverage excluding United States (for half the monthly premium of the first plan) The United States in an extreme outlier in terms of cost. This is separate from rationing care. This is separate from even population health (ex…

I went into the hospital for shortness of breath but my main issue was fluid accumulation. I had 3 paracenthesis procedures and was hooked up to a drip of Lasic and a catheter bag for 20 days. I didn't even recognize that I was in the ICU until I got the bill. They charged $194,000. Insurance claims they paid $193,781. Of that, it was $7300 a day for staying in the ICU. My ambulance ride was $2500 for an 11 minute tr…

With rates like that, you could at least argue that everyone is HIGHLY incentivized to keep you alive

Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#708

Post by guax » Sun, Feb 23, 2025, 6:50 AM UTC

rollinDyno wrote: post #633

IAmGraydon wrote: post #588

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, but while I disagree with Musks actions, more than half of the 14 items don’t fit what’s currently happening.

In his essay, Eco says no instance of fascism will present itself with all items. He starts out by saying that fascism is very hard to define, so the 14 item list is meant to be a soft guide more than an absolute rule book. I am starting to accept that this is a conversation we are going to be having over and over again, even after Elon and Trump. We are rightly traumatised by the excesses of the past, so it's very e…

Every fascist leanings gets compared to Germany where it's more akin to Italy, East European or South American models of strong man and/or militaristic.

Everyone compares everyone to the worse so anything short of that gets way too much acceptance. I don't think Elon or the movement he's part of is full on Nazi not will become one. It's still bad and shameful.

Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#709

Post by rat87 » Sun, Feb 23, 2025, 6:51 AM UTC

cuuupid wrote: post #533

uses wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if you’re 100% correct, these aren’t the right people and these aren’t the right methods. Completely the opposite actually.

There are 5 different existing agencies within the government that all exist for essentially the same purpose -- to track and audit government spending. None of them have been successful in any capacity over the last 20 years. It's easy to just go online and say "this is wrong these people are idiots" but what is your alternative solution? We have exhausted pretty much every other method at this point, all the big co…

> None of them have been successful in any capacity over the last 20 years.

Citation needed. They do their jobs, problem is politians also do theirs. Making sure military doesnt cut spending in their district even if military leaders think a base or tank factory is not needed.

Its easy to say this is wrong and these people are idiots because thats the case. Actually I wont even say theyre all idiots theyre just malicous and dont care about the damagr they cause. This isnt some sort of careful attempt to make goverment work better. Its axing random groups because they once said something positive about minorities or necause they prosecute political corruption or because they can install their own cronies or outsource it to their company

Re: DOGE's only public ledger is riddled with mistakes

#710

Post by scintill76 » Sun, Feb 23, 2025, 6:52 AM UTC

cuuupid wrote: post #84

I think impartial observers have not spent time in actual government bureaucracy. Basically everything will seem like “they’re cutting something important!” Or “they’re stopping critical research!” because every government contract needs justification; so naturally they will all sound good. The data and accounting itself is such bad quality in all cases that it is impossible to be perfect at this; there are entire in…

Bringing up Palantir is funny to me. I don’t know enough gossip on Musk and Thiel’s relationship, but if I did I would bet it would solely determine the outcome of a hypothetical DOGE investigation into Palantir contracts. It seems from a sibling comment I’m not alone. If we’re right, DOGE isn’t going to eliminate government waste and corruption, just move it around.

We’re not gaslit into thinking everything was fine with government spending, we’re angry that this is how they’re going to “fix” it.