Earlier quoted context omitted.
> you take the help you can get Was it really help if the outcome ends up being worse than without any help? I'm taking about loss of life, property, and land.
Loss of freedom?
Yes that too
Ukraine not invited to US-Russia peace talks, source tells BBC
41–48 of 48 posts
Re: Ukraine not invited to US-Russia peace talks, source tells BBC
#42Re: Ukraine not invited to US-Russia peace talks, source tells BBC
#43Earlier quoted context omitted.
> These aren’t peace talks then, they’re talks on how to divide up the spoils. That's what peace talks are all about. Do you think Japan and Germany had a say in what they had to give up at the end of WW2?
Both Japan and Germany attacked other countries to expand their empire. Like Russia in this conflict.
> Both Japan and Germany attacked other countries to expand their empire.
That's completely irrelevant to the outcome
Re: Ukraine not invited to US-Russia peace talks, source tells BBC
#44[flagged]
“Programmed” seems like a foolishly reductive (not to mention arrogant) way of describing other countries’ politicians and political decisions, given the hot war happening on EU’s doorstep.
a brutal as hell "hot war" that was churning out 1200 casualties a day for weeks
and whose instigator is ideologically aligned with "Dugan-ism" which calls for Russian dominance of Europe (aka "Neo-Eurasianism")
EU has every reason to be greatly worried about this
Re: Ukraine not invited to US-Russia peace talks, source tells BBC
#45The result of this seems like it would be: "Congrats, we sold you out." Administration officials had all sorts of condescending "they did a good job defending themselves but ... " quotes before the election.
they did a good job defending themselves but ...
...Putin is paying our campaign funding, so yeah sorry
Re: Ukraine not invited to US-Russia peace talks, source tells BBC
#46These aren’t peace talks then, they’re talks on how to divide up the spoils.
> These aren’t peace talks then, they’re talks on how to divide up the spoils. That's what peace talks are all about. Do you think Japan and Germany had a say in what they had to give up at the end of WW2?
they floated treaties and peace offerings... and most of those were like "we get to keep all of Asia that we hold, we just stop shooting, and will throw $$2 billion your way"
the Allies all met together and decided on the course of action on several occasions, like at Yalta
Re: Ukraine not invited to US-Russia peace talks, source tells BBC
#47Sykes-Picot agreements weren't just for your great grandparents.
Re: Ukraine not invited to US-Russia peace talks, source tells BBC
#48Earlier quoted context omitted.
Mineral aquisition is a bit of a furphy here .. in my estimation the more important goals for Russia here were expanded access to Black Sea ports, main land access to Crimea, and water supply security to Crimea ... and a nostalgia for the Olde Russian Empire Made Great Again.
I think it was mainly about not losing face internally when the separatists would have been defeated. Like, there was a bridge. Water can be piped. The port in Sevastopol was big enough. Etc. And there is no way some mines can repay all the costs just as the invasion of Iraq wouldn't be repaid by Iraqi oil ever.
>Water can be piped.
No, you underestimate the scale of ecological catastrophe imposed on the Crimea by Ukrainian regime.
" “After five years without water, the population structure of the villages of the steppe regions of Crimea looks depressing. By the end of 2020, 90% of the remaining population will be unemployed. All the rest will leave the region,” concludes Liev.
...
According to Liev, in the last 50 years, when the irrigation functioned, the peninsula received a new layer of fertile land. However, in the last 5 years, this soil has not been moistened enough and is already degraded.
...
As an occupying power, Russia is entirely responsible for the maintenance of the Crimean region according to the Geneva Convention, says Permanent Representative of the President of Ukraine in the Crimea Anton Korynevych. Ukraine’s task is to make the occupation as burdensome for Russia as possible. The water supply to Crimea may be effectively used by Ukraine to put additional pressure on Russia so that it returns Crimea." [0]
Note, that the title of this article published by Ukrainian "Euromaidan Press" is "Ukraine’s water blockade of Crimea should stay, because it’s working". Enough said.
[0] https://euromaidanpress.com/2020/02/27/ukraines-water-blocka...