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Why young parents should focus on building trust with their kids

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Re: Why young parents should focus on building trust with their kids

#291

Post by axegon_ »

lupire wrote: post #199
axegon_ wrote: post #62

My mom has this very interesting theory: A parent needs to be by a child's side for the first 6-7 years of their life and devote all their time to it. Which is what she did with me. My dad stepped up for the challenge and provided for both of us. My mom had one goal: to make sure that I'd stay curious. She taught me how to read at the age of 4, signed me up for piano lessons(I haven't played piano at all nearly 3 dec…

Your father is a parent and didnt parent 6 years by your side. Why didn't your mother step up to support that? If a mother can replace a father in this role, why can't a teacher? Why doesn't a child need some freedom and independence to discover their own internal motivations and creativity?

Cause they sat down, discussed it like rational adults and came to some logical conclusions: my dad was more entrepreneurial and a bigger workhorse whereas my mom has a much wider scope of interests and knowledge, which is to say, more knowledge to share, even if they ultimately graduated the same university. And now that I'm an adult (and have been for a long while now), I do appreciate the sacrifices they made and can safely say that they genuinely did the absolutely best job they could have done with very limited resources and a lot of compromises on their end. Something which I did not see when I was a child or a teenager, even though it was in front of my face.

To the second question - for most teachers, looking after a child is their job. 18:00, work's over, adios. To most teachers, children are just that: work. Which is not the same as rising your own child. I don't have children to say that with certainty and the closest thing I have to a child is a dog. I love all(most) dogs but I'll walk the extra mile for my own dog. Also, welcome to eastern Europe, where the biggest struggle in the 90's was having food on the table, so tough luck having a teacher.

I'm also a prime example that being near a child does not mean that the child will follow your path: my parents: artists. Me - software engineer, who can't draw a straight line even if my life was on the line. My parents - terrified of fast speeds or extreme sports. Me - well I have double digit scars all over my body from skateboards to bicycles to head butting a flower pot.

Re: Why young parents should focus on building trust with their kids

#292

Post by gretch »

kodt wrote: post #276
edferda wrote: post #142

I don’t have kids. However, this same concept can be applied, and verified, with dogs. I have made it a rule to never deceive my dog, and she trusts me because it. If I pick up her water bowl to refill and clean it while she is in the middle of drinking, I make it a point to always give it back with fresh water. I have several water bowls around the house , and the one in my room only gets refilled when I see she is…

So if your dog required medication, you would never hide the pill in peanut butter for example?

It's not a deception, in the same way that a chicken nugget is not chicken hidden inside of breading.

It simply is pill with peanut butter

Re: Why young parents should focus on building trust with their kids

#293

Post by rusk »

christophilus wrote: post #172
rusk wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They do care about it. It’s an immensely important milestone in the development of the field, and is pretty much axiomatic as a developmental marker and has been widely and consistently replicated. Where modern day psychology diverges is (as discussed in the article) on the conclusions and analysis.

Counterpoint: https://www.theguardian.com/education/2018/jun/01/famed-impu...

My point of view is based on this very paywalled article.

In science a study doesn’t just become bunk just because its original conclusions no longer hold, or because a journalist says so.

The data is solid and is widely replicated. All the guardian article attacks is the analysis and conclusions.

And it is correct to do so, as that is how scientific discourse works. The journalist was however incorrect in saying it had been debunked.

Mischel is indeed still taught and students are taught to think critically about it.

Modern pedagogy uses it as a solid reference point both in terms of development and also in the limitations of empirical data.

Psychology is not like other sciences. It’s very nature is questioning established shibboleths and you’d be crazy to think that prevalent thought hadn’t moved on from a study done more than 50 years ago.

Re: Why young parents should focus on building trust with their kids

#294

Post by [deleted] »

michaelt wrote: post #281
rahimnathwani wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The original paper has been cited 2000 times: https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&scioq=... That's a lot of citations for something they 'just do not care' about.

I agree. But do bear in mind, an intro textbook for a 101 class aiming to correct popular misunderstandings; or an experimental guide wanting to give examples of mistakes one should avoid; or an article on the replication crisis would also count as citations, even as they sneered at the original faulty work.

[deleted]

Re: Why young parents should focus on building trust with their kids

#295

Post by ujkhsjkdhf234 »

lolinder wrote: post #229
silisili wrote: post #33

I feel like this article is good, on the verge of great, then makes cultural comments that invalidate the point trying to be made for no real reason. Like the race or location of the parent determines their childhood? The rest is spot on. I became a parent before I was ready, and man, they are little sponges. They learn everything you do, everything you say, embarrassingly so. My 5 year old would lay on the couch to…

I'm going to quote the paragraph you're responding to so that those just reading the comments can see what it actually says: > The marshmallow test also doesn’t account for cultural differences. In some cultures, waiting is baked into daily life. Think about Japan, where kids are often taught to wait quietly for meals or gifts. Compare that to the US, where instant gratification is practically a way of life. These cu…

This is a White America thing and it is why we are in the situation we are in as a country but people want to pretend that race and culture doesn't play any role in anything. It does. You don't need to feel bad about it. Just acknowledge that it is a thing.

Re: Why young parents should focus on building trust with their kids

#296

Post by rubslopes »

kodt wrote: post #276
edferda wrote: post #142

I don’t have kids. However, this same concept can be applied, and verified, with dogs. I have made it a rule to never deceive my dog, and she trusts me because it. If I pick up her water bowl to refill and clean it while she is in the middle of drinking, I make it a point to always give it back with fresh water. I have several water bowls around the house , and the one in my room only gets refilled when I see she is…

So if your dog required medication, you would never hide the pill in peanut butter for example?

I think this case is excused by the fact that you have no way of explaining why the medicine is important.

Re: Why young parents should focus on building trust with their kids

#297

Post by mgfist »

andrewla wrote: post #287
mgfist wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think the author disagrees. He's not implying that the marshmallow test is the cause for success. I think he says what you say - that passing the marshmallow test is a measure of success of how well you parented a child. Note the last sentence: > And who knows, maybe one day they will pass their own version of the marshmallow test The marshmallow test is just a rhetorical symbol for patience and virtue. I.e.…

The idea of the article is to create an environment at home so that your child feels secure in the sense of being able to pass the marshmallow test. This is the same sort of logic that leads to the idea that you should have a large home library, because that is predictive of success, or make sure your kids don't have holes in their shoes because that is predictive of success. If you "fix" these things they lose their…

> If you "fix" these things they lose their predictive power. Similarly if everyone tries to modify their parenting behavior so that the children can pass a hypothetical marshmallow test, then you will find that the test is no longer predictive of success.

Maybe in the end nurture has no impact and the result is 100% due to nature. But what's the point in being a parent if that's the case? At that point is a philosophical debate akin to determinism vs free will. Maybe everything is pre-determined. And if it is, then why bother do anything?

I think the moral of the article is that children will do as you do. So probably better to do virtuous things. Maybe in the end it won't matter, but nothing really matters in the end.

Re: Why young parents should focus on building trust with their kids

#298

Post by helboi4 »

graemep wrote: post #239
helboi4 wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're really not. Europe is diverse enough that you need to split it into quadrants to decide what countries are relatively similar. Like is Finland similar to Germany from an outside perspective? Yes. Is Finland similar to southern Italy? Absolutely not, you'd be better off comparing southern Italy and latin America, and Finland with Japan. Like seriously, those will have more in common with each other than Finlan…

Lots of similarities. "Europe is diverse enough that you need to split it into quadrants to decide what countries are relatively similar" The same is true for South Asia, but if you look at it from a western perspective you see the similarities. There are plenty of similarities across Europe. Shared attitudes to sex, politics, religion..... things like freedom of worship and separation of church and state (laws restr…

I dunno how what you're saying negates my point. I was actually gonna add that the same thing can be said of Asia, which even more so needs to be split into quadrants to find clear similarities in culture.

Re: Why young parents should focus on building trust with their kids

#299

Post by wincy »

DiscourseFan wrote: post #284
Lionga wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably because Psychology is super individual und culturally dependent. Nothing Psychologists ever "find out" generally applies, but just happens in their little circle und their circumstances in their time.

Except the incest taboo, which is not culturally dependent.

I don’t know, I read a Pakistan Today article where a doctor said cousin marriage is no big deal as it “only” causes defects in 2% of cases. Interestingly, this article is now impossible to find on Google. You can find a dozen news articles of people in the UK arguing about this.

Hopefully the discourse is shifting, but a culture can be dysfunctional (like allowing first cousin or even worse double first cousin marriages, for example) for a very long time before it collapses.

Re: Why young parents should focus on building trust with their kids

#300

Post by librish »

graemep wrote: post #104
silisili wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You reject that peoples personalities are shaped by their environment No, I reject that you can tell anything meaningful about the environment by country. Or even state. Or even neighborhood! Japan itself could fit into the US 25 times by area. Are kids raised in SF the same as those raised in Alabama? Or NY vs Phoenix? It'd be insane to make any generalities about a country so large and diverse, IMO. Heck, kids in…

There are huge variations within a country, but they are far smaller than variations between countries. It seems to be to be a common failing in the west to underestimate just how big differences are between themselves and other cultures. The two cultures I have lived in, despite being Britain and one of its former colonies (and therefore partially anglophone, similar political system, lots of other influences) are q…

> There are huge variations within a country, but they are far smaller than variations between countries.

That's not true. To use the examples in the thread, a patient American kid will be much more patient than an impatient Japanese kid.

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