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AI systems with 'unacceptable risk' are now banned in the EU

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Re: AI systems with 'unacceptable risk' are now banned in the EU

#131

Post by eru »

sethd wrote: post #97
teekert wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have been having a lot of laughs about all the things we call AI nowadays. Now it’s becoming less funny. To me it’s just generative AI, LLMs, media generation. But I see the CNN folks suddenly getting “AI” attention. Anything deep learning really. It’s pretty weird. Even our old batch processing, SLURM based clusters with GPU nodes are now “AI Factories”.

Even the A* search algorithm is technically AI.

Well, it used to be. But whenever we understand something, we move the goal posts of what AI is.

At least that's what we used to do.

Re: AI systems with 'unacceptable risk' are now banned in the EU

#132

Post by dingnuts »

throwaway743 wrote: post #109
jeltz wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you use biometric data to predict the weather?

I trained a CV model to tell me the temp when I stand in front of the mirror based on if my nipples are hard or not, and how hard or soft they are.

if you set up your thermostat to respond to the output from your model you could get it to turn up the temperature by pinching your nipples

Re: AI systems with 'unacceptable risk' are now banned in the EU

#133

Post by johndhi »

abdullahkhalids wrote: post #113
spacemanspiff01 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the laws text: For the purposes of this Regulation, the following definitions apply: (1) ‘AI system’ means a machine-based system that is designed to operate with varying levels of autonomy and that may exhibit adaptiveness after deployment, and that, for explicit or implicit objectives, infers, from the input it receives, how to generate outputs such as predictions, content, recommendations, or decisions that c…

Seems very reasonable. Not all software has the same risk profile, and autonomous+adaptive software certainly have a more dangerous profile than simpler software, and should be regulated differently.

What? Why? Shouldn't those same use cases all be banned regardless of what tech is used to build them?

Re: AI systems with 'unacceptable risk' are now banned in the EU

#135

Post by dbetteridge »

scarface_74 wrote: post #67
Kbelicius wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That’s just the problem. Meta was going to give users a choice between paying with “private data” or paying money. Well, per GDPR they aren't allowed to do that. Are they giving that option to users outside of EU? Why Not? > The EU won’t let people make that choice are you saying people in the EU are too dumb to decide for themselves? No I do not think that. What made you think that I think that? What about sex and…

> Well, per GDPR they aren't allowed to do that. Are they giving that option to users outside of EU? Why Not? Because no other place thinks that their citizens are too dumb to make informed choices. > What about sex and organs? In your opinion should businesses be allowed to charge you with those? If consenting adults decide they want to have sex as a financial arrangement why not? Do you think these 25 year old “gir…

There's a fundamental difference I think in the European mindset on private data and the American.

From the European mindset: private data is not "given" to a company, the company is temporarily allowed to use the data while that person engages in a relationship with the company, the data remains owned by the person (think copyright and licensing of artistic works).

American companies: think that they are granted ownership of data, just because they collect it. Therefore they cannot understand or don't want to comply with things like GDPR where they must ask to collect data and even then must only use it according to the whims of the person to whom it belongs.

Re: AI systems with 'unacceptable risk' are now banned in the EU

#137

Post by aithrowawaycomm »

eru wrote: post #131
sethd wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even the A* search algorithm is technically AI.

Well, it used to be. But whenever we understand something, we move the goal posts of what AI is. At least that's what we used to do.

It's not "moving the goalposts." It's realizing that the principles behind perceptrons / Lisp expert systems / AlphaGo / LLMs / etc might be very useful and interesting from a software perspective, but they have nothing to do with "intelligence," and they aren't a viable path for making machines which can actually think in the same way a chimpanzee can think. At best they do a shallow imitation of certain types of formal human thinking. So the search continues.

Re: AI systems with 'unacceptable risk' are now banned in the EU

#138

Post by sunshine-o »

Never forget the EU is run by lobbies by design. So usually those scary regulations are not what they seem to be.

Here is what happened in most corporations when GDPR came out:

- An new Chief Privacy Officer would be appointed,

- A series of studies would be conducted by big consulting firms with a review of all processes and data flow across the organisation,

- After many meeting they would conclude that a move to the cloud (one of the big ones) is the best and safest approach. The Chief Privacy and Legal Officer would put their stamp on it with some reservations,

- This would usually accelerate a lot of outsourcing and/or workforce reduction in IT,

- Bonus if a big "data governance" platform is bought and half implemented.

Re: AI systems with 'unacceptable risk' are now banned in the EU

#139

Post by shortsunblack »

daedrdev wrote: post #91
dns_snek wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People said that about GDPR. Laws that don't leave any room for interpretation are bound to have loopholes that pose unacceptable risk to the population.

I think its quite clear gdpr has indeed lead to lower investment and delayed or cancelled products in Europe

By which data is that clear? If anything, GDPR has lead to greater investment in areas that actually matter. Zero knowledge proofs, pseudonymization techniques, user friendly open-source SaaS products such as NextCloud.

Re: AI systems with 'unacceptable risk' are now banned in the EU

#140

Post by shortsunblack »

wiz21c wrote: post #56
troupo wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Maybe if the GDPR was a simple law It is a simple law. You can read it in an afternoon. If you still don't understand it 8 years later , it's not the fault of the law. > instead of 11 chapters and 99 sections News flash: humans and their affairs are complicated > all anyone got as a benefit from it is cookie banners Please show me where GDPR requires cookie banners. Bonus points: who is responsible for the cookie b…

> Please show me where GDPR requires cookie banners. That's the bit everyone forget. GDPR didn't ask for cookie banners at all. It asked for consent in case consent is needed. And most of the time consent is not needed since I just can say "no cookies" to many websites and everything is just fine.

Consent is never "needed". Consent is one of many legal bases that allows for data processing to take place. If other legal bases than consent do not apply, the industry can use "consent" as a get out of jail card. Consent as a legal basis was heavily lobbied by Big Tech.

If even consent does not apply, then the data shall not be processed. That's the end of it.

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