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AI systems with 'unacceptable risk' are now banned in the EU

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Re: AI systems with 'unacceptable risk' are now banned in the EU

#121

Post by dmix »

layer8 wrote: post #107
theptip wrote: post #89

Seems like a mostly reasonable list of things to not let AI do without better safety evals. > AI that tries to infer people’s emotions at work or school I wonder how broadly this will be construed. For example if an agent uses CoT and they needs emotional state as part of that, can it be used in a work or school setting at all?

This quote is inaccurate. The actual wording is: "the placing on the market, the putting into service for this specific purpose, or the use of AI systems to infer emotions of a natural person in the areas of workplace and education institutions, except where the use of the AI system is intended to be put in place or into the market for medical or safety reasons;" and it links to https://artificialintelligenceact.eu/r…

Is this just based on hypothetical scenario they sat in a room coming up with or has such a thing been tried and harmed people?

Re: AI systems with 'unacceptable risk' are now banned in the EU

#123

Post by DocTomoe »

jeffgreco wrote: post #98
daedrdev wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think its quite clear gdpr has indeed lead to lower investment and delayed or cancelled products in Europe

Yet better privacy protections than we in the States enjoy.

The EU in a nutshell:

You can't have nice things, but on the bright side Google/Apple/Facebook won't know what you had for dinner.

Now give us your whole financial transaction and travel history, so we can share it with the US, a hostile country, citizen!

Re: AI systems with 'unacceptable risk' are now banned in the EU

#124

Post by DocTomoe »

dijksterhuis wrote: post #53
hcfman wrote: post #52

So is a burglar alarm that uses AI to see a person on your property and alert the owner (Same function as the old PIR sensors) now AI tech that is predicting that there is a person that might be wanting to commit a crime and thus a banned use of AI now? Or is it something that is open to interpretation, let the courts sort of out and fine you 15,000,000 euros if someone in the EU has leverage on the courts and doesn'…

From the act: > to assess or predict the risk of a natural person committing a criminal offence, based solely on the profiling of a natural person or on assessing their personality traits and characteristics ; more details in recital 42: https://artificialintelligenceact.eu/recital/42/

In all fairness, that would still ban a system that understands my front door being approached by a guy in a postal uniform wearing a parcel is likely unproblematic, while a guy wearing a hoodie and a crowbar is likely to commit a crime.

Re: AI systems with 'unacceptable risk' are now banned in the EU

#125

Post by nielsole »

dmix wrote: post #121
layer8 wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This quote is inaccurate. The actual wording is: "the placing on the market, the putting into service for this specific purpose, or the use of AI systems to infer emotions of a natural person in the areas of workplace and education institutions, except where the use of the AI system is intended to be put in place or into the market for medical or safety reasons;" and it links to https://artificialintelligenceact.eu/r…

Is this just based on hypothetical scenario they sat in a room coming up with or has such a thing been tried and harmed people?

While this is not primarily emotion, I hope it would squarely be covered by it: https://bigthink.com/the-present/attention-headbands/

Re: AI systems with 'unacceptable risk' are now banned in the EU

#126

Post by cwillu »

Zenst wrote: post #96
theptip wrote: post #89

Seems like a mostly reasonable list of things to not let AI do without better safety evals. > AI that tries to infer people’s emotions at work or school I wonder how broadly this will be construed. For example if an agent uses CoT and they needs emotional state as part of that, can it be used in a work or school setting at all?

I would imagine that such a tool to infer emotional states would be most useful for autistic people who are as I can attest, somewhat handicapped upon that front. Maybe that will get challenged as disability discrimination by some Autistic group. Which would be interesting. As with most things, there are rules, and exceptions to those rules - no shoe fits everyone, though forcing people to wear the wrong shoe size, c…

On the other hand, as someone who's emotional state is routinely incorrectly assessed by people, I can't imagine a worse hell than having that misassessment codified into an ai that I am required to interact with.

Re: AI systems with 'unacceptable risk' are now banned in the EU

#127

Post by nielsole »

unification_fan wrote: post #108
layer8 wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This quote is inaccurate. The actual wording is: "the placing on the market, the putting into service for this specific purpose, or the use of AI systems to infer emotions of a natural person in the areas of workplace and education institutions, except where the use of the AI system is intended to be put in place or into the market for medical or safety reasons;" and it links to https://artificialintelligenceact.eu/r…

We need to profile your every thought and emotion. Don't worry though, it's for medical or safety reasons only. Same for your internet history... You know, terrorism and all. Can't have that.

I can definitely see use cases where cameras that detect distressed people can help prevent harm from them and others.

Re: AI systems with 'unacceptable risk' are now banned in the EU

#129

Post by btown »

spacemanspiff01 wrote: post #47
DoingIsLearning wrote: post #33

I am not expert but there seems to be an overlap in the article between 'AI' and well ... just software, or signal processing: - AI that collects “real time” biometric data in public places for the purposes of law enforcement. - AI that creates — or expands — facial recognition databases by scraping images online or from security cameras. - AI that uses biometrics to infer a person’s characteristics - AI that collect…

From the laws text: For the purposes of this Regulation, the following definitions apply: (1) ‘AI system’ means a machine-based system that is designed to operate with varying levels of autonomy and that may exhibit adaptiveness after deployment, and that, for explicit or implicit objectives, infers, from the input it receives, how to generate outputs such as predictions, content, recommendations, or decisions that c…

Notably, Recital 12 says the definition "should not cover systems that are based on the rules defined solely by natural persons to automatically execute operations."

https://uk.practicallaw.thomsonreuters.com/Glossary/UKPracti... describes a bit of how recitals interact with the operating law; they're explicitly used for disambiguation.

So your hip new AI startup that's actually just hand-written regexes under the hood is likely safe for now!

(Not a lawyer, this is neither legal advice nor startup advice.)

Re: AI systems with 'unacceptable risk' are now banned in the EU

#130

Post by Spooky23 »

daedrdev wrote: post #91
dns_snek wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People said that about GDPR. Laws that don't leave any room for interpretation are bound to have loopholes that pose unacceptable risk to the population.

I think its quite clear gdpr has indeed lead to lower investment and delayed or cancelled products in Europe

Speed isn’t always ideal. My favorite example that getting dated in hotel WiFi.

Early adopters signed contracts with companies that provided shitty WiFi at high prices for a long time. A $500 hotel would have $30/night connections that were slow, while the Courtyard Marriott had it for free.

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