Seagate: 'new' hard drives used for tens of thousands of hours • Hacker News Board

Re: Seagate: 'new' hard drives used for tens of thousands of hours

#11

Post by giancarlostoro » Wed, Jan 29, 2025, 2:32 PM UTC

Hamuko wrote: post #7

I've recently been browsing Amazon.de listings for a new HDD and I'm pretty sure I saw someone complain about their supposedly new Seagate EXOS already having hours on it. I also saw listings for SATA drives where the reviews were complaining about receiving SAS drives and complaints about bare HDDs being shipped rattling around in large cardboard boxes. I think the only conclusion I reached was that I should buy my…

I only buy SSDs from Amazon honestly. Much rather get my hard drive in person, which sucks, most retailers don't have extensive options.

Re: Seagate: 'new' hard drives used for tens of thousands of hours

#12

Post by jerf » Wed, Jan 29, 2025, 2:33 PM UTC

diggan wrote: post #4

felindev wrote: post #2

> the company launched an official eBay store that sells refurbished drives. [...] However, this store only sells in the US One could make a joke that seagate did start selling refurbs in EU, just without telling anyone. Why is it always seagate when there's something wrong with HDDs?

> One could make a joke that seagate did start selling refurbs in EU, just without telling anyone. Regulators and prosecutors/lawyers would probably be the only ones laughing about that. AFAIK, consumer protections are much worse in the US, so if anything it would be the opposite. > Why is it always seagate when there's something wrong with HDDs? If it isn't Seagate, it's someone else. Wasn't Western Digital caught s…

"AFAIK, consumer protections are much worse in the US, so if anything it would be the opposite."

Claiming you're selling a new product and then selling a used product is straight-up fraud. This isn't even a warrantee issue, and no, the US legal system wouldn't just shrug and go "Oh well". This is the sort of thing that penetrates any amount of verbiage in a EULA the company may throw at you, including any sort of demand to go through arbitration, and depending on how widespread this is could easily become class-action, which is the corporate nightmare the forced-arbitration clauses are trying to avoid. You can't write yourself an open-ended right to commit basic fraud into any contract, no, not even in the US.

Re: Seagate: 'new' hard drives used for tens of thousands of hours

#13

Post by baobun » Wed, Jan 29, 2025, 2:33 PM UTC

Hamuko wrote: post #5

baobun wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why is it always seagate when there's something wrong with HDDs? WDs image was IIRC already not the best when the WD Red SMR thing blew up. I recall feeling smug but forget the background. I think they have a strong claim on title of most scandalous HDD maker.

Does any WD model have its own Wikipedia page? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ST3000DM001 (I had one, it died just after its warranty ended but Seagate did send me a replacement after bitching about it for long enough.)

I agree it's not an easy call between the two! I guess the conclusion of this episode could tip the scales, if we ever get an explanation.

My best guesses right now are some mix of organized crime disrupting their German distribution and/or less publically acknowledged graymarket/OEM channels gone wrong.

If it really comes from inside Seagate I don't think a sane person would buy from them again.

It gets more nuanced when talking about their responsibility to keep oversight over their supply chains and distribution.

Re: Seagate: 'new' hard drives used for tens of thousands of hours

#14

Post by fred_is_fred » Wed, Jan 29, 2025, 2:34 PM UTC

felindev wrote: post #2

> the company launched an official eBay store that sells refurbished drives. [...] However, this store only sells in the US One could make a joke that seagate did start selling refurbs in EU, just without telling anyone. Why is it always seagate when there's something wrong with HDDs?

It's not clear to me that this is Seagate's fault. Sounds like retailers are selling used drives as new. Or is wiping the SMART data only something Seagate corporate can do?

Re: Seagate: 'new' hard drives used for tens of thousands of hours

#15

Post by immibis » Wed, Jan 29, 2025, 2:34 PM UTC

diggan wrote: post #4

felindev wrote: post #2

> the company launched an official eBay store that sells refurbished drives. [...] However, this store only sells in the US One could make a joke that seagate did start selling refurbs in EU, just without telling anyone. Why is it always seagate when there's something wrong with HDDs?

> One could make a joke that seagate did start selling refurbs in EU, just without telling anyone. Regulators and prosecutors/lawyers would probably be the only ones laughing about that. AFAIK, consumer protections are much worse in the US, so if anything it would be the opposite. > Why is it always seagate when there's something wrong with HDDs? If it isn't Seagate, it's someone else. Wasn't Western Digital caught s…

Okay, almost always Seagate. Their drives fail at over an order of magnitude higher rates, too.

Re: Seagate: 'new' hard drives used for tens of thousands of hours

#16

Post by rycomb » Wed, Jan 29, 2025, 2:36 PM UTC

trompetenaccoun wrote: post #8

One way some companies and merchants deal with high inflation and increasing price pressure seems to be declining quality. I've seen similar things happening more frequently in different markets, not just tech. If you notice something like it, the best way to deal with it imo is ask for your money back, make it public if possible and boycott the business from then on. Customers need to penalize such behavior as much…

Indeed. Seems that Amazon is doing this more and more. Here in the US, I've just received a used (and damaged) Rode microphone, sold and shipped by Amazon 'as new'. And as you said, I returned it and decided not to order anything valuable from them, ever again.

Still, I wonder if these (arguably illegal) practices are still worth it for merchants and companies, considering that there's no enforcement and the majority of consumers don't drastically change their shopping habits when being abused.

Re: Seagate: 'new' hard drives used for tens of thousands of hours

#17

Post by nbernard » Wed, Jan 29, 2025, 2:37 PM UTC

quesera wrote: post #6

Article is about reports from German customers (this is clear in the orignal title, but not the current HN title), and mostly with 16TB Exos HDDs. FWIW, I just bought a bunch of Seagate HDDs (US vendor) and my warranty periods line up with the DOMs on the packaging. You can check your warranty period/status at: https://www.seagate.com/support/warranty-and-replacements

Thanks! I just checked an 10TB Ironwolf bought to a German seller through Amazon.fr less than two months ago: Its warranty expires in a few days... :(

Re: Seagate: 'new' hard drives used for tens of thousands of hours

#18

Post by dylan604 » Wed, Jan 29, 2025, 2:39 PM UTC

immibis wrote: post #15

diggan wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> One could make a joke that seagate did start selling refurbs in EU, just without telling anyone. Regulators and prosecutors/lawyers would probably be the only ones laughing about that. AFAIK, consumer protections are much worse in the US, so if anything it would be the opposite. > Why is it always seagate when there's something wrong with HDDs? If it isn't Seagate, it's someone else. Wasn't Western Digital caught s…

Okay, almost always Seagate. Their drives fail at over an order of magnitude higher rates, too.

This reminds me that I haven't seen a drive report from Backblaze in a while posted here.

Re: Seagate: 'new' hard drives used for tens of thousands of hours

#19

Post by Cerium » Wed, Jan 29, 2025, 2:39 PM UTC

Hamuko wrote: post #7

I've recently been browsing Amazon.de listings for a new HDD and I'm pretty sure I saw someone complain about their supposedly new Seagate EXOS already having hours on it. I also saw listings for SATA drives where the reviews were complaining about receiving SAS drives and complaints about bare HDDs being shipped rattling around in large cardboard boxes. I think the only conclusion I reached was that I should buy my…

Why buy any drives from Amazon? I always buy from a specialty dealer. Where I am that's usually B&H.

Re: Seagate: 'new' hard drives used for tens of thousands of hours

#20

Post by Supercompressor » Wed, Jan 29, 2025, 2:41 PM UTC

The headline makes this out to be deception by Seagate but the article reads as if it's just one shady, but approved distributor who's sneaking these out as new drives.