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The number of traffic deaths is far higher than of victims of any psychos.
You have Manhattan traffic death numbers?
43K fewer drivers on Manhattan roads after congestion pricing turned on
51–60 of 228 posts
Re: 43K fewer drivers on Manhattan roads after congestion pricing turned on
#52"We made something more expensive to do and you'll never believe that fewer people did it!"
You joke, but critics were literally saying this. Stuff like "it's only $9, people will just ignore that and continue to drive"
To be fair, they were mostly right, since 93% continued to drive.
This is commute tax for the wealthy, and a time tax for lower income people. B39 only crosses the bridge, so there's waiting/transfer on both sides. Commute is generally 2-5x more time by public transport there, with all the stops.
Re: 43K fewer drivers on Manhattan roads after congestion pricing turned on
#53When I see things like: > Bus speeds also increased after the tolls were turned on. The Manhattan-bound B39 bus, which crosses the Williamsburg Bridge, ran 28% faster compared to a similar January week last year. Other buses like the SIM24 and and the M50 saw increases in speeds, as well. I wonder how much cherry picking there is. Did they give the B39 because it's the most improved? Or for some other reason (especia…
Not sure if NYC would do the same stunt, but London saw an amazing improvement in traffic flow after congestion charge was introduced. Turned out for several months prior to it they'd been slowly shifting the timing of lights to make things less optimal, and then reverted the day congestion charge went live.
Would you have a source for this?
Re: 43K fewer drivers on Manhattan roads after congestion pricing turned on
#54Earlier quoted context omitted.
This comment is a good example of the type of narrow minded progressive thinking that has held back good public policy like congestion pricing and carbon taxes. Both of these programs are criticized as being regressive. The criticism neglects to take into consideration the society wide benefits like more efficient bus travel or cleaner air that preferentially help the less well off.
Why not lottery my dude (based on dob, license plate, whatever) ? Didn’t I equally pay for the infrastructure? I would argue that I paid even more than the millionaires, because I cannnot cheat on my taxes.
Oh god. Didn't they try to do something like this in Mexico City and it resulted in no change? Clever policy is always rife with unintended consequences; prices are good.
Re: 43K fewer drivers on Manhattan roads after congestion pricing turned on
#55Comparing to previous Januarys seems dishonest given the vast number of layoffs that have occurred over the past year. Doesn't appear as though they're controlling for this number at all..
What vast number of layoffs? The national layoff rate is currently 1.1%, which is lower than the the pre-pandemic average [0]. The NYS layoff rate is 0.5% which is one of the lowest in the country.
[0] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/JTSLDR [1] https://www.bls.gov/charts/state-job-openings-and-labor-turn...
Re: 43K fewer drivers on Manhattan roads after congestion pricing turned on
#56Roads in cities are such a waste of space. A long time ago I did a quick survey of SF and found something like 20% of the land was dedicated to cars. Some articles from people here that talk about this [1] [2] [3]. That is the most subsidized land on the planet but people don't think of it that way. They think roads are free so any tax to use them is wrong. That space could be helping out the city in so many ways but…
You’re not incorrect per se, but it’s important to note that deliveries into downtown would be important for it to be a thriving destination for shopping, residential or business. Not to mention space for heavy equipment to come in to do repairs and construction. Minimal maintenance corridors may not be enough.
You also need public transit options into it as well as transportation solutions for “out of towners” who descend onto downtown for some event (eg public parking lots outside the city that has public transit to the event).
It can be an easier and more politically popular idea to just use streets to solve this problem at the individual level even if less efficient rather than requiring efficient central management planning by the government.
And just to be clear, I’m a fan of the changes SF is making, just highlighting some of the challenges, not to mention that SF isn’t going quite so far as to rip up existing streets with the exception of the latest vote where the entire city basically voted against the will of the outer sunset to convert the highway to a park and not just closed on the weekends as it’s been since COVID (increasing maintenance costs due to erosion are another huge reason it’s a good idea).
Re: 43K fewer drivers on Manhattan roads after congestion pricing turned on
#57Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not sure if NYC would do the same stunt, but London saw an amazing improvement in traffic flow after congestion charge was introduced. Turned out for several months prior to it they'd been slowly shifting the timing of lights to make things less optimal, and then reverted the day congestion charge went live.
Would you have a source for this?
Various buttholes, presumably.
Anyone who has ever tried to adjust the phase of a traffic signal can tell you that sneaking little changes, all over a large city, is fantasy.
Re: 43K fewer drivers on Manhattan roads after congestion pricing turned on
#58Comparing to previous Januarys seems dishonest given the vast number of layoffs that have occurred over the past year. Doesn't appear as though they're controlling for this number at all..
Number of employed people rose in NYC over the last year[0] if I’m reading the stats correctly.
[0] - https://dol.ny.gov/system/files/documents/2024/12/nychist.xl...
Re: 43K fewer drivers on Manhattan roads after congestion pricing turned on
#59Earlier quoted context omitted.
You could have progressive congestion pricing based on the value of the car. I didn't look at it, but what I think you're saying is that this is a regressive pricing control. I think that's an important point: regressive taxes/fines shouldn't be used to control behavior as it disproportionately impacts the less affluent* But a progessive scheme is more involved - it might require using the value of the car for exampl…
There are reduced rates people can apply for. Agreed though, I think tolls, traffic tickets, and parking tickets should all be baselined against the KBB value of the car.
With these fancy AI systems, they could read the license plate and see the registered value and go from there.
My beef is with gas taxes, for which the $100k electric car owner pays none of and which are highly regressive to poorer ICE car owners. I suggest they should be abolished.
Re: 43K fewer drivers on Manhattan roads after congestion pricing turned on
#60[flagged]
the people who most strongly value $9 over a drive into lower Manhattan, to be more accurate