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Ads chew through half of mobile data

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Re: Ads chew through half of mobile data

#171

Post by pavel_lishin »

aschla wrote: post #68
pavel_lishin wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A solution for you and some other tech savvy individuals; not a great solution for the rest of my family. Plus, it ignores the systemic problem in exchange for personal one-off bandaids.

A one-off solution like this is really the only type of solution we have in the face of a massive ad tech industry that largely piggybacks on top of, and inserts itself into, foundational network and web protocols. Fixing the problem itself would likely require legislation and regulation to get ad tech companies (or the companies that use the ad tech) to pay attention to the data use.

So, there are two solutions - one-off bandaids, and legislation.

Re: Ads chew through half of mobile data

#172

Post by adriancr »

hombre_fatal wrote: post #128
adriancr wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

sucks to not have ublock origin.

I suppose, but Safari/Webkit shows that you can get what feels like 95% of the way there with static block lists which are ideal when they are sufficient. They're faster and they're trustless. The only attack surface of a block list is that someone removes their site from the list.

you wouldnt have auto playing videos with ublock origin. 95% might be nice but theres a lot missing.

The static blocklists can be defeated easily by having ads served by the same domain.

In that case you are stuck due to apple's decisions.

Re: Ads chew through half of mobile data

#173

Post by karaterobot »

Workaccount2 wrote: post #126
imoreno wrote: post #117

Maybe the ISP should start charging the ad network instead of the user for ad traffic. Then they can start blocking the ads of people who don't pay. The user, who pays for the service, is getting no value out of the ads and the advertiser is freeloading the ISP's technical infrastructure and userbase.

The internet as you know it is the value you get out of ads. You may hate ads, we all do, but at least recognize the hand that feeds you. The alternative is subscriptions for everything, and as far as I can tell that is far less popular than the ad model we have.

You've got to say more about what you mean by that, especially how you know what everyone else finds valuable on the internet.

Re: Ads chew through half of mobile data

#174

Post by icehawk »

Workaccount2 wrote: post #126
imoreno wrote: post #117

Maybe the ISP should start charging the ad network instead of the user for ad traffic. Then they can start blocking the ads of people who don't pay. The user, who pays for the service, is getting no value out of the ads and the advertiser is freeloading the ISP's technical infrastructure and userbase.

The internet as you know it is the value you get out of ads. You may hate ads, we all do, but at least recognize the hand that feeds you. The alternative is subscriptions for everything, and as far as I can tell that is far less popular than the ad model we have.

The internet as I know it is the value I get out of interacting with other people.

I've never had a moment where I've said "Oh, I'm glad that ad was there!"

If a service can't be run unless it's through ads?

Then perish.

Re: Ads chew through half of mobile data

#175

Post by swayvil »

Workaccount2 wrote: post #126
imoreno wrote: post #117

Maybe the ISP should start charging the ad network instead of the user for ad traffic. Then they can start blocking the ads of people who don't pay. The user, who pays for the service, is getting no value out of the ads and the advertiser is freeloading the ISP's technical infrastructure and userbase.

The internet as you know it is the value you get out of ads. You may hate ads, we all do, but at least recognize the hand that feeds you. The alternative is subscriptions for everything, and as far as I can tell that is far less popular than the ad model we have.

There is a feast. You get a crumb. The problem isn't that part of that the internet needs part of that crumb to function. The problem is that you get only a crumb. Let's not pretend otherwise.

Re: Ads chew through half of mobile data

#176

Post by lolinder »

freehorse wrote: post #160
Workaccount2 wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The internet as you know it is the value you get out of ads. You may hate ads, we all do, but at least recognize the hand that feeds you. The alternative is subscriptions for everything, and as far as I can tell that is far less popular than the ad model we have.

I do not get this argument at all. We all eventually bear the cost of ads by them adding cost to the products being advertised that we buy. Nothing is free.

Not to mention that treating ad-funded as equivalent to free arrogantly assumes that I, personally, am somehow immune to the manipulation inherent in advertising.

Companies pay for ads because they have good reason to believe that some significant percentage of people who see them will buy something that they otherwise would not have bought. They spend enormous sums setting up the infrastructure to attribute sales to specific ads. Meanwhile we, the consumers, have no really good way to quantify how much drains from our bank accounts each year due to the ads we see.

Might I be the exception to the rule and be un-manipulatable? Possibly. But I don't have a strong reason to bet on it, and I'd rather see the price of the service listed outright as a subscription than simply hope that the ad-funded version will net to a lower cost for me.

Re: Ads chew through half of mobile data

#177

Post by icehawk »

dgrin91 wrote: post #163
lolinder wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The valuable parts of the internet are, with few exceptions, ad-free. Forums like HN, personal blogs and sites, paid services—these are the places where real value is to be found on the internet. The ad-funded content and services are almost universally low quality and designed exclusively to hack brains to keep them scrolling, not provide real value. What few exceptions there are to this rule are not worth the enorm…

Is this really true? Virtually all news sites, regardless what side you agree with, have ads. Basically all entertainment has ads (or subscriptions). Productivity stuff is either full of sales or upsells, aka ads, or alternatively sell your data (for future ads). Those are all valuable things. The ad free ones are the exceptions. More over they only exist ad free because the money comes from elsewhere.

Not really sure how you come to the conclusion those are all valuable things.

Re: Ads chew through half of mobile data

#179

Post by mannyv »

imoreno wrote: post #117

Maybe the ISP should start charging the ad network instead of the user for ad traffic. Then they can start blocking the ads of people who don't pay. The user, who pays for the service, is getting no value out of the ads and the advertiser is freeloading the ISP's technical infrastructure and userbase.

That would be against the whole idea of 'net neutrality.'

Which is why I agree. The user is paying for those ads, and the infrastructure is being upgraded to serve those ads. Why do ads get subsidies?

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