I disagree with this being presented as if it was special. It’s standard operating procedure for intelligence agencies worldwide.
Its probably more a question of scale that makes China unique.
How China turns members of its diaspora into spies
91–100 of 249 posts
Re: How China turns members of its diaspora into spies
#92I disagree with this being presented as if it was special. It’s standard operating procedure for intelligence agencies worldwide.
This is not standard operating procedure worldwide, in part because there aren't that many countries folks are trying to flee to:
> America granted him asylum and he settled in New York, becoming the leader of Chinese pro-democracy groups. But in August 2024 he was arrested by the FBI. He admits to having used his position to collect information for the Chinese government and to report on his fellow activists. He did this so that the government would allow him to return to China to see his ailing parents.
Re: How China turns members of its diaspora into spies
#93Soon enough anything that is even remotely a security threat (pretty much any non-trivial app) will require clearance and in office work. The North Korean hacks into several companies are an example of how bad it is now, add in some good deep fake technology and soon you will not be able to distinguish who is actually working for your company.
> Soon enough anything that is even remotely a security threat [...] will require clearance and in office work. I think this is one of those things that sucks but may be necessary. You need to trust the knowledge workers that make up your economy to not send your research to a hostile nation so they can take advantage of your R&D investments. And you need to know that your critical infrastructure (beyond Internet and…
[flagged]
Re: How China turns members of its diaspora into spies
#94Earlier quoted context omitted.
The US government is a meandering blob of racoons in a trenchcoat. Occasionally a hand will _do_ evil but even odds whether they realize it or meant it. Partially depends on which particular raccoon is where. Some of the racoons are evil. China is actively directed by a small group of well coordinated, evil raccoons. See, you know, the constant genocide.
Yes. This is really exactly my take, too. The US Government has done incredibly stupid and catastrophically foolish and harmful things - being hoodwinked into Vietnam by the French, for example - but the Government is not inherently, actually evil, in any way, shape or form. This is not the case for China.
The US govt has no agency, got it.
Re: How China turns members of its diaspora into spies
#95In the UK Chinese funded international masters/phd students have to send back to China reports about their fellow students as a condition of their funding. There's no mandatory spying expected if the position is funded privately or by the host institution. I expect that the spying is just limited to their fellow state funded students although I have heard of significant tension between mainland and Hong Kong students…
I take it these reports don't stop when they are interns?
Re: How China turns members of its diaspora into spies
#96Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Emigrants always have ties to the originland. China can coerce it's diaspora through their family ties and social circle back home[1]. That isn't normal and is very difficult to pull off in democratic countries. 1. https://www.propublica.org/article/operation-fox-hunt-how-ch...
[flagged]
whom did america genocide last year?
Re: How China turns members of its diaspora into spies
#97Think of how many Indian spies exist in the US... Is it OK just because there is no anti India narrative in the US?
India is nowhere near being a superpower that could challenge the US so I think the threat is not the same. Plus Indian society is a bit more open and free than Chinese so lots of people told to spy can easily come out.
The superpower aspect is true. Otherwise, India is very friendly with Russia. But we (i.e. big capital) want their H1B labor and outsourcing, so the narrative isn't there yet and many tech companies are headed by Indian CEOs.
I'm exaggerating the above, but until recently China wasn't deemed to be a problem either, so the narrative does seem to play a role.
Re: How China turns members of its diaspora into spies
#98[flagged]
Many other countries would help people with opportunistic industrial espionage so there is a distinct advantage to proactively working with their spy agencies. This is not the case in the West, there is still industrial espionage but it's established and not opportunistic so far fewer people are involved.
Re: How China turns members of its diaspora into spies
#99In the UK Chinese funded international masters/phd students have to send back to China reports about their fellow students as a condition of their funding. There's no mandatory spying expected if the position is funded privately or by the host institution. I expect that the spying is just limited to their fellow state funded students although I have heard of significant tension between mainland and Hong Kong students…
I take it these reports don't stop when they are interns?
Depends if the funding stops. I think if they get a job at the university and do not need the funding, then the reports can stop.
Re: How China turns members of its diaspora into spies
#100Earlier quoted context omitted.
How does it work in US, you just look at the guy and then he sends you his IBAN? Aren’t companies required to establish an employee’s origin by bureaucratic means? IDs, SSNs, notarized copies, work permit, etc? Why are North Korean guys even a problem, it feels like they shouldn’t be able to fake identification numbers and permits, unless something is fundamentally wrong with the country’s accounting.
Indeed there is such a thing, it's the I-9 document check and is required for all new employees. The problem is that identity theft is so ridiculously easily in the US that it's trivial for bad actors to just steal someone's identity. The solution is to fix identity theft.
This starts with the framing. One does not have their identity stolen. The counterparty is instead defrauded into believing something that is not true - and the problem must be made entirely theirs.