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The trap of "I am not an extrovert"

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Re: The trap of "I am not an extrovert"

#301

Post by logifail »

robertlagrant wrote: post #225
smsm42 wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's one thing I noticed - the author doesn't say "would you like me to introduce you to X who you could talk to about Y?". He says "hey, go talk to that guy" and thinks he's being kind. He's not. What Aditya could be hearing is "you're some kind of loser, there are so many obvious things any normal person would do, and you are doing none of them. Let me list some ways in which you are a loser. For example, you cou…

This doesn't seem to relate much to the parent comment. The idea of someone introducing you to someone else at a party is them helping.

> The idea of someone introducing you to someone else at a party is them helping

Umm ... along the lines of "helping" someone to learn to swim by pushing them into the deep end of a swimming pool?

Re: The trap of "I am not an extrovert"

#302

Post by AbstractH24 »

0xEF wrote: post #295
thrw42A8N wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What this guy describes is social anxiety, not introversion.

I mean, lets also avoid pretending there is zero overlap. I am an introvert largely because my brand of social anxiety causes me to function better in typically introverted ways. Introvertedness is a spectrum as opposed to something with clearly defined boundaries.

Would it be fair to say “You are an introvert by necessity rather than by choice”?

Re: The trap of "I am not an extrovert"

#303

Post by litenboll »

markeroon wrote: post #108
vouaobrasil wrote: post #9

One thing to me is fairly obvious: people who are introverts can be social, but only for limited amounts of time. For example, I like talking a lot, but I can only do it for limited amounts of time. Maybe only a few hours a week. If I'm pushed past that point, I just don't want to chat any more. It's like I'm full of food, but with socialization. After that I find socialization immensely distasteful and irritating. T…

> Extroverts don't understand this concept of limited capacity for socialization. Othering >50% of your audience isn’t the best way to make a point, and plenty of extroverts understand this concept perfectly well (myself as an example).

I agree that making an absolute statement like that is not great. But surely, if you understand the concept, you also know that it's way too common for extroverts having zero understanding that some people need to be alone to recharge. They'll call you boring when you don't want to go out after being at the office for 8 hours already, for example. "Come on, it will be so much fun! What will you do when you get home? Play games lol? Come on get out in the world and meet some people!!" It's also very common for extroverts to assume that just because you need to recharge by not being with people that introverts don't like being with people in the first place.

Social energy for me is a bit like physical energy. I love working out, but then I get tired and need to rest. In this analogy the extroverts somehow gets more energy while working out. That part is very hard for me to understand.

The pandemic was a total eye opener for me. I always thought that (ever since I started working) I didn't like to go to after works, nor parties in the weekend. What I realized was that I really love those things, but that my social battery drains completely at the office so I needed the evenings and most of the weekend to keep running. Hybrid work has complete changed my ability to socialize outside work.

Re: The trap of "I am not an extrovert"

#304

Post by sweezyjeezy »

croes wrote: post #292
sweezyjeezy wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apart from the line "does it help in some ways, sure" the overall message of their post is that the author is wrong and that you can be equally successful without being sociable, which is a general statement. It's not really supported by the anecdata that OP is a skilled, unsociable, successful person. That only tells us that this person, in their particular line of work, with their particular set of skills, can be s…

That an introvert can be successful is a generally true statement if at least one introvert is successful. Given parent is an introvert and succesful the statement is true.

Yeah but the statement in question is (quote) "you can be EQUALLY successful as an introvert" - and we're talking about whether people should, generally, strive to be more extroverted at work. That there exists a successful introvert is not in question and isn't a good criticism of the article to me.

Re: The trap of "I am not an extrovert"

#305

Post by nuancebydefault »

MoreMoore wrote: post #154
nuancebydefault wrote: post #76

To introverts I would say: just now and then try to get out of your comfort zone. Most of the time, it will feel liberating and next time it becomes much easier. Step 1. Regularly talk to strangers. Most easily it can be done at public transport or at a shop. Start with places where you are waiting for a short time. Just ask a silly question or say something about the weather. Step 2 speak up in small groups. Just sa…

As an introvert, I have no idea what you're talking about. As an introvert, talking to strangers is in my comfort zone. Being an introvert has nothing to do with whether I'm able to talk to strangers. As an introvert, speaking up in small groups isn't a problem. I do it all the time when I feel like it or when I feel it's necessary. Again, what does being an introvert have to do with this? As an introvert, I regularl…

After reading all that, I think I'm an introvert as well. Though people tend to label me extrovert.

Even though getting downvotes, there's a lot to learn on HN, even about myself!

Re: The trap of "I am not an extrovert"

#306

Post by andyjohnson0 »

Interesting article because it made me [1] think. But poor article because the author's apparent lack of awareness leads them to get so much wrong.

I suspect that the author is a straight-up extravert who thinks that introversion is the same as shyness (its not), and that their claim to be an "introvert in friendship" allows them to claim to be "deep" (wrong again, introversion is not a virtue and extraversion is not the same as superficiality).

Basically this reads like some think piece I'd expect to see on LinkedIn. Kind of like "How to Succeed as a Senior Staff Engineer", written by a 23 year old.

I wonder how the author of this piece will feel about it later in their life - perhaps as their awareness of the limits of their awareness becomes clearer.

[1] I identify as an introvert

Re: The trap of "I am not an extrovert"

#307

Post by atleastoptimal »

I am an introvert not because I don’t like socializing with people, but rather because I can’t shake the impression that they don’t like socializing with me (and I have been proven right in this notion).

In order to become more likable I’ve had to adopt an extremely perceptive and self critical mental framework to analyze every thing I could be doing wrong to annoy or offend people. It has worked, and people seem to like me more, but the mental exhaustion it induces has led to me often yearning for alone time.

I wonder if introverts like me are common: those who enjoy socializing very much when they feel socially safe, but rarely feel socially safe.

Re: The trap of "I am not an extrovert"

#308

Post by 0xEF »

AbstractH24 wrote: post #302
0xEF wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, lets also avoid pretending there is zero overlap. I am an introvert largely because my brand of social anxiety causes me to function better in typically introverted ways. Introvertedness is a spectrum as opposed to something with clearly defined boundaries.

Would it be fair to say “You are an introvert by necessity rather than by choice”?

That's a strangely difficult question for me to answer, this being the first time I've been asked. What is your intention with it? You have me curious.

Thinking briefly on my answer, I would argue (mostly with myself) that it is a mix of both. For example, I consciously make choices about how to conduct my day or a specific task that will fall within the boundaries of my best operational parameters...which I understand makes me sound like a robot, but I am anything but (nor do I understand enough about robotics to pretend otherwise). It's just a matter of having enough self-awareness to listen to what my brain and body tells me works and does not work for me, noting what does work, then trying to accommodate myself for best results. In another comment, an introvert mentioned they can get up on stage and talk to a room of 500 people if they had to. I can do the same thing...so long as I know I have nothing to do the next day, because that action will cost me a ton of processing power and I will need to rest for a long time compared to, say, an extrovert. So, there's a consequence to be consider when making that choice to get up and talk to that room of people.

Alternatively, this also begs necessity. As someone who has actually been diagnosed and rediagnosed with anxiety and having tried different types of treatment to see what works and what does not work (choice, again?) I have learned one thing is for certain; this is not a thing that will just go away or be "cured" in the traditional meaning of the word, so it becomes necessary to learn to work around it.

In my experience, our choices and necessities are often the same, so it's a blurry question with a blurry answer.

Re: The trap of "I am not an extrovert"

#309

Post by nuancebydefault »

NikolaNovak wrote: post #85
nuancebydefault wrote: post #76

To introverts I would say: just now and then try to get out of your comfort zone. Most of the time, it will feel liberating and next time it becomes much easier. Step 1. Regularly talk to strangers. Most easily it can be done at public transport or at a shop. Start with places where you are waiting for a short time. Just ask a silly question or say something about the weather. Step 2 speak up in small groups. Just sa…

Good advice but we need to change its scope: All of that works if your problem is shyness or being self conscious. And indeed there's a strong Venn diagram between shyness, quietness, self consciousness, awkwardness, and introvertness. But it's not the same. I'm inherently all of those things. After 20 years in consulting though, including dedicated training and experience, nobody believes me anymore - I've built str…

Today I learned, being skilled at something does not mean it has to become less exhausting. Could it be that your acquired social skills somehow go against your 'nature'? I wonder if there is social research on this subject.

Re: The trap of "I am not an extrovert"

#310

Post by steve1977 »

atoav wrote: post #239
thayne wrote: post #178

This feels like the author has made the assumption that since they are an introvert, all introverts are like them. However, I think that introversion, like most things is a continuum, not binary. Take the characterization of introverts in the article: "They would rather sit in front of the computer than go out during the yearly college social fest." For me it isn't just a matter of "I'd rather be in front of a comput…

I am an introvert and I can (and if necessary will) take over the microphone and address a room with 500 people in it. I might even enjoy that a little. What makes me an introvert isn't that I am shy (I am not), what makes me an introvert is that I find all interaction with other people except a select few exhausting and draining. Don't get me wrong: That doesn't mean I am weird or bad at talking with people — in fac…

I'm very much like this. I often compare social gatherings to activities like hiking. I might go for a hike from time to time and I might even enjoy it, but it will be exhausting and I will need some time after the hike to recharge.
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