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Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

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Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#71

Post by mihaaly »

tetrisgm wrote: post #30

This project brilliantly points out that we are limited and shaped by how keys and layouts are presented to us. What I don’t understand is why not go all the way. Why not also change the concept of what’s needed to enter a character? It would make sense that keys aren’t the ideal affordance to express a key every time. Use a volume slider for a letter, use radio buttons, on/off toggles. What if I could draw the lette…

I'd put some random keys on the bottom of my seat or wired into the TV remote or the doorbell button of my neighbours. The ordered shape and regular size, position of keys is too much of a burden to mee, constricts my wondering creative mind too much.

Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#72

Post by willwade »

tetrisgm wrote: post #30

This project brilliantly points out that we are limited and shaped by how keys and layouts are presented to us. What I don’t understand is why not go all the way. Why not also change the concept of what’s needed to enter a character? It would make sense that keys aren’t the ideal affordance to express a key every time. Use a volume slider for a letter, use radio buttons, on/off toggles. What if I could draw the lette…

Heard of dasher ? https://www.inference.org.uk/dasher/

Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#73

Post by bluGill »

karencarits wrote: post #39
qrobit wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would be 24 if all digits are distinct It actually drops from 10^4=10000 to 4^4=256 combinations

I guess you would be able to count the number of clean keys and thus know both the number of distinct digits and the digits (but not the order nor which digit that's repeated)

The number that is repeated is likely to be dirtier than the numbers that are not so you get that information too.

Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#74

Post by bluGill »

cudder wrote: post #59
shae wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're also limited and shaped by keyboards. Why only one letter per finger? The datahand does five! Why are key switches only press? What about analog partial key press? There are Hall effect keyboard switches that do that, I want to try some. What about finger twist for input? I don't think anything exists? Would that be a volume knob on a key switch?

> What about analog partial key press? There are Hall effect keyboard switches that do that, I want to try some. That sounds fun, now I really want to try out a keyboard where half press is lowercase and full press is UPPERCASE! No more pinky strain from shift presses.

Some pipe organs have keyboards that support that. I can't figure out when it started, but my guess is the 1920s. No hall effect, they had mechanical contacts. (I've never got to play one and always wondered if you could feel when the two positions were hit or if you had to guess and rely on sound - organ pipes often have a long delays between when you press the key and when the speak)

Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#75

Post by bluGill »

Shorel wrote: post #69

This mixed with LED keycaps that change to reflect the current assigned letter would be awesome. For hunt and peck typists.

Seems like eink would be better, but the smallest I can find is about 3cm so much too big. If you can get them smaller though...

Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#76

Post by natlight »

atomer wrote: post #28

Took me 1 year to rewire my brain to switch from Qwerty to Dvorak (I struggled with from RSI for nearly 6 years) and nearly 2 years to gain full speed. It is hard, very hard for the brain. It is mentally tiring to rewire your brain like this and you will do your job at a much worse efficiency (forget pair programming for a while). You need new keyboard stickers also. Great job at making this idea but it is not practi…

I switched to Dvorak 20 years ago and I love it. It only took me about 2 weeks to learn and to pass my qwerty typing speed. I could actually touch type on either keyboard for the first year or two after I switched. I recommend not using stickers or dvorak keyboards at all, it helps you learn faster and your family won't get pissy because they can't use your computer anymore.

Also, it is not difficult to use other peoples computers. You can switch keyboards pretty easy these days on windows and mac. In fact, my very first computer (Apple IIc) had a mechanical switch to flip between qwerty and dvorak.

Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#77

Post by MrJohz »

all2 wrote: post #5
jslezak wrote: post #3

Yes! I have been wanting this forever. Keys are in too predictable a position

There were, for awhile, some security systems had on-screen keyboards that would change layout on every key press.

A number of countries use this when giving your pin for a credit card or similar (I've noticed it in both Greece and India).

I can't help but feel like it's less secure than the default layout - I'm quite good at hiding my PIN and typing quickly, but when the positions of the numbers are randomised, I feel like I practically end up saying my PIN out loud as I try and remember it.

Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#78

Post by bluGill »

amelius wrote: post #47

I'm still looking for a way to produce quality keycaps at home.

I too am looking. I started drawing on a napkin how it would work. Basically injection mold the letter and stem only in one color, then put that in a different mold and injection mold the rest of the key around that. Seem like it should work, but I haven't done enough injection molding to know how feasible it might be (letters don't seem to bad, but 5/% probably needs a 4 part mold or something and I can't imagine keeping all the parts together). Worse, there is a lot of tiny machining operations needed and so for a one off my cost per key gets to be $15 each (mostly on tiny bits needed that will thus break often).

3d resin printers might be a good option, my background leans to injection molding so I didn't think of it until now. Here you would print two pieces and then snap them together.

Both of the above have the letter molded through the key and so whatever chemicals are in my fingers won't destroy the lettering after a year of use. Though plastic selection is also important otherwise my fingernails will destroy the key anyway in a short time. Not everyone has fingers/skin chemistry like mine and so some won't understand why I care while others are all in with me.

Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#79

Post by WorldMaker »

CaptainFever wrote: post #35
tetrisgm wrote: post #30

This project brilliantly points out that we are limited and shaped by how keys and layouts are presented to us. What I don’t understand is why not go all the way. Why not also change the concept of what’s needed to enter a character? It would make sense that keys aren’t the ideal affordance to express a key every time. Use a volume slider for a letter, use radio buttons, on/off toggles. What if I could draw the lette…

> What if I could draw the letter on my trackpad? The Apple Newton did that! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Newton#Notes

The Apple Watch can do it today.

(In iMessage, as one easy example app, there's an entry box to send a new message. If you tap into that and get a keyboard click the keyboard icon in the bottom corner and there's a "moving finger" icon you can tap to get a trackpad to draw letters on. Older and smaller Watches won't even have the keyboard and will just have the trackpad.)

Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#80

Post by WorldMaker »

encom wrote: post #54
atomer wrote: post #28

Took me 1 year to rewire my brain to switch from Qwerty to Dvorak (I struggled with from RSI for nearly 6 years) and nearly 2 years to gain full speed. It is hard, very hard for the brain. It is mentally tiring to rewire your brain like this and you will do your job at a much worse efficiency (forget pair programming for a while). You need new keyboard stickers also. Great job at making this idea but it is not practi…

And there's also the problem of using computers that aren't yours. I haven't tried (and I will never), but I imagine switching between layouts is at least very inconvenient.

Dvorak is supported by almost every computing device under the sun today. Old Apple models (I want to say the IIc?) even had a hardware button to switch layouts. Switching between Dvorak and Qwerty is usually an easy to find User setting. (If doing it on someone else's user account, you just have to remember to be kind and switch it back when done.)

As a Colemak touch typer I envy that some days. Colemak is available easily everywhere but Windows. macOS, iOS, Android, and Linux all have it similarly out of the box with Dvorak, but Windows it still requires an install and that install still requires Admin approval because keyboard layouts are needed by kernel-level drivers. But I knew that when I switched, took a few years to realize there's no shame in hunt-and-pecking on QWERTY when using someone else's machine.

(I was also privileged when I switched to know that I didn't need to use shared machines. I was far enough along in grad school where I was allowed/encouraged to do everything on a personal laptop, and the few remaining "lab classes" with shared machines all allowed Remote Desktop. That took advantage of things like if you remote desktop back to one of your own machines, your remote machine still responds to your chosen layout once you've logged in. Just have to hunt and peck long enough to type your machine's address, username, and password.)

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