Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths • Hacker News Board

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#331

Post by nicoburns » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 9:42 PM UTC

guyzero wrote: post #131

My Canadian parents are in their 80's so naturally a lot of their friends of the same age are dying. And two of them have been via MAID. In one case, which was surprising to me, a man who had survived cancer - he was not terminal but certainly wasn't getting any better - elected to die via MAID after his wife died. She passed, he called his doctor and less than a week later he was also dead. He got a chance to visit…

It's not at all surprising to me! I fully expect to want to euthanise myself once I'm done with life (and I'm going to be pretty upset if it's not an option for me when it gets to that point).

People tell me I'll change my mind (perhaps similarly to how people treat people who say they don't want kids). But I doubt I will. I've seen lot's of older people (and people who's lives are not good) still want this when it comes to the time when it applies. The only reason it's not more commonplace is social stigma (and legal obstacles) against it.

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#332

Post by Rebelgecko » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 9:42 PM UTC

patrickhogan1 wrote: post #148

Strange question but how does this affect life insurance? Typically a suicide would not be covered.

Not sure how it works in Canada, but in the US I think most life insurance actually does cover suicide. There's usually just a stipulation that suicide isn't covered if it happens immediately after someone signs up

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#333

Post by wonger_ » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 9:44 PM UTC

dogman1050 wrote: post #119

After watching my father die with COPD, it because obvious that euthanasia happens in the US all the time. He opted out of lung-reduction surgery and was ready to die. So the hospital withheld IV hydration and provided a morphine drip and he was gone in 36 hours. How long can one live without water, a few days max? So that's what killed him. My sister-in-law who's a physician told me that's how it's typically done. I…

Reminds me of this experience of someone from the UK: https://jameshfisher.com/2017/05/19/granddad-died-today/

"Terminal dehydration is a way to skirt the Suicide Act, because we can claim that withholding water is just like withholding treatment. Ramping up painkillers and sedatives is a way to skirt the Suicide Act, because we can claim that the medication helps the patient cope with their death, rather than inducing their death."

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#334

Post by nicoburns » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 9:44 PM UTC

pinkmuffinere wrote: post #269

karencarits wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I appreciate you sharing your perspective. I wondered, when you described feeling "really sad" and the sense that people "might as well have been dead," I'm wondering if you're speaking about your own emotional response or trying to convey how the individuals themselves felt about their situation? Edited to sound less harsh

(I’m not op) The full quote is > At the end, while technically alive, so little of who they were as persons remained, they might as well have been dead. It sounds like there was some severe mental decline. When undergoing this kind of mental decline, does anybody remain happy? That’s meant as a genuine question, not rhetorical. Of course I’ve heard of the cases where people are constantly scared, feel unsafe, confuse…

> When undergoing this kind of mental decline, does anybody remain happy?

According to some people I know who work in care homes: yes, some people do. They're confused, have no idea what's going on, but are nevertheless mostly happy.

(but that is in no way to negate the fact that many don't)

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#335

Post by nashashmi » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 9:44 PM UTC

mjevans wrote: post #196

nashashmi wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This! People feel like they cannot live alone or they cannot want that someone else be caused hardship (time or money) because of their difficulty. I feel like I will get downvoted to oblivion just because people vehemently disagree, but THIS CANNOT be the meaning and choice behind death. It is simply immature, arrogant, and selfish. But more plainly, it is suicidal / self-relentment.

My sample size as an adult is still small, but I've seen this in pets and I've seen this in humans. The downward slope quickens faster than any would like once it starts. The body or the mind slips away, leaving someone either trapped in a shell that doesn't work, or momentary fragments of the person who was among a sea of futile vapid existence. Our medical technology is not there and shows little sign of being clos…

You might be narrowing the definition of life to mean "body and mind fully active; useful spirited existence; painless existence". But ask the senile when they are no longer senile, or the once-despressed, or the ones who live in pain (sickle-cell anemic?) if death is better.

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#336

Post by Rebelgecko » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 9:45 PM UTC

freddie_mercury wrote: post #200

betaby wrote: post #88

[flagged]

12 cases a year in a country of 40 million people doesn't sound like very much.

40 million doesn't seem like the right denominator - how many veterans called the hotline?

They also lost/didn't store phone records so it's totally possi there are more who can't talk about their experiences because they accepted the offer of MAiD

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#337

Post by rahimnathwani » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 9:45 PM UTC

guyzero wrote: post #131

My Canadian parents are in their 80's so naturally a lot of their friends of the same age are dying. And two of them have been via MAID. In one case, which was surprising to me, a man who had survived cancer - he was not terminal but certainly wasn't getting any better - elected to die via MAID after his wife died. She passed, he called his doctor and less than a week later he was also dead. He got a chance to visit…

I can understand this intellectually/rationally, but I can't imagine actually making such a decision.

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#338

Post by masterj » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 9:46 PM UTC

hattmall wrote: post #298

caseyohara wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who decides on the duration of the waiting period? Why can’t people be in charge of their own lives? Especially people in their 80s, they have earned the right to agency. It reminds me of OB/GYN providers that deny childless women sterilization procedures – even when they are in their 30s – ostensibly on the risk that the woman might change their mind about having children. Some people know things for certain and the…

The issue is that every OB/GYN has seen patients that regret the decision. And for most they will have seen instances where that regret ultimately led to suicide. Do you really want to be the doctor that didn't press for more consideration for a patient that ultimately takes their own life? I get the idea of giving women control but as a doctor it's also their right to refuse a procedure to not bear that burden. It's…

[flagged]

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#339

Post by rahimnathwani » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 9:47 PM UTC

karencarits wrote: post #242

RandomThoughts3 wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be honest, my grand parents both died in their nineties and their last two years were really sad. It was not so much the physical decline but the mental one. At the end, while technically alive, so little of who they were as persons remained, they might as well have been dead. I fully understand someone in their 80s knowing the end is near choosing to leave on their own term.

I appreciate you sharing your perspective. I wondered, when you described feeling "really sad" and the sense that people "might as well have been dead," I'm wondering if you're speaking about your own emotional response or trying to convey how the individuals themselves felt about their situation? Edited to sound less harsh

FWIW this seems like a reasonable question.

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#340

Post by strken » Thu, Dec 12, 2024, 9:47 PM UTC

karencarits wrote: post #242

RandomThoughts3 wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be honest, my grand parents both died in their nineties and their last two years were really sad. It was not so much the physical decline but the mental one. At the end, while technically alive, so little of who they were as persons remained, they might as well have been dead. I fully understand someone in their 80s knowing the end is near choosing to leave on their own term.

I appreciate you sharing your perspective. I wondered, when you described feeling "really sad" and the sense that people "might as well have been dead," I'm wondering if you're speaking about your own emotional response or trying to convey how the individuals themselves felt about their situation? Edited to sound less harsh

My grandmother was absolutely unambiguous about it. Even when she was still mobile and living at home, she'd say things like "I hope it's my time soon" and "I want to follow your grandfather." Quite happily, too. She didn't seem depressed. Just sick and tired of her friends dying and her own inability to do anything for herself.