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Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

bbc.com

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Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#151

Post by MichaelZuo »

dogman1050 wrote: post #119

After watching my father die with COPD, it because obvious that euthanasia happens in the US all the time. He opted out of lung-reduction surgery and was ready to die. So the hospital withheld IV hydration and provided a morphine drip and he was gone in 36 hours. How long can one live without water, a few days max? So that's what killed him. My sister-in-law who's a physician told me that's how it's typically done. I…

I’ve heard it’s even more common per capita than in Canada, the difference being that it’s not on the record, so no statistics are collected about it.

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#152

Post by Retric »

bluefirebrand wrote: post #134
Retric wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If only that were true. Someone unable to move is unable to take their own life without assistance. A surprisingly large percentage of people go through some horrific experiences before their bodies completely fail.

This is a vanishingly small percent of cases Someone who is unable to move is probably also unable to unambiguously communicate their wish to be euthanized as well so I really don't think it's that relevant

Bed sores are a reasonable proxy for people being unable to move and they are a common enough risk to be a significant concern.

If you can’t even roll over then you’re at the mercy of whatever people are willing to bring you even if you can speak or use a TV remote just fine.

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#153

Post by darth_avocado »

guyzero wrote: post #142
darth_avocado wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn’t call someone dealing with cancer and the loss of his wife sound of mind within one week of the loss.

He had apparently expressed his intention before she passed. I do not know all the details and this is second hand, but he apparently had a plan.

I would’ve expected at least a waiting period longer than a week after a traumatic event. Of course I don’t know all the circumstances around it.

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#154

Post by nashashmi »

guyzero wrote: post #131

My Canadian parents are in their 80's so naturally a lot of their friends of the same age are dying. And two of them have been via MAID. In one case, which was surprising to me, a man who had survived cancer - he was not terminal but certainly wasn't getting any better - elected to die via MAID after his wife died. She passed, he called his doctor and less than a week later he was also dead. He got a chance to visit…

This! People feel like they cannot live alone or they cannot want that someone else be caused hardship (time or money) because of their difficulty.

I feel like I will get downvoted to oblivion just because people vehemently disagree, but THIS CANNOT be the meaning and choice behind death. It is simply immature, arrogant, and selfish. But more plainly, it is suicidal / self-relentment.

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#155

Post by drjasonharrison »

mp05 wrote: post #115
afh1 wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no "we". There are people and their bodies and their wishes. And authoritarians who want a say on it. Doesn't matter if nice sounding words like law and democracy are used to describe the tyranny.

Yep that's one side of the argument and it's valid and I sympathize with it. The other side is when you're hearing stories of people being told that, in lieu of the procedure they're about to undergo, they can surely sign up to receive state-approved death. "Are you sure you don't want to just die? This is gonna hurt a lot!" Ghoulish.

How often does this occur? Citations?

Elderly cancer patients who have a recurrence of cancer often know exactly how uncomfortable another round of chemotherapy, radiation, or surgery will be. At the same time they may already be suffering neurological pain, pleural effusion (fluids building up in the chest), etc.

In this context the statement might be:

"This treatment, as you know, is going to be very unpleasant, has little hope of curing you, and you could live your life while the cancer progresses. We could slow it down and let you decide how you want to live your life."

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#156

Post by reverendsteveii »

bluefirebrand wrote: post #132
afh1 wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no "we". There are people and their bodies and their wishes. And authoritarians who want a say on it. Doesn't matter if nice sounding words like law and democracy are used to describe the tyranny.

Reality is much messier than "There are people and their bodies and their wishes." There are whole categories of people who we consider not well enough to make good choices about their bodies and lives, for a variety of reasons Children are not emotionally mature or responsible enough to make such choices Mentally ill people are sometimes in an altered state of mind where they are not making good decisions that are c…

The fun part of the mentally-ill categorization is that being mentally ill also has a tendency to lead to poverty and homelessness which in turn will increase the likelihood that someone will opt for MAID but could be solved by other social means.

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#157

Post by imtringued »

snakeyjake wrote: post #26

In an ideal world 100% of all deaths would be by euthanasia. Instead there are accidents, which kill prematurely. Homicides, which steal life. And diseases, which cripple and degrade. I've watched three of my four grandparents suffocate to death as their organs failed, blasted out of their minds on morphine, nothing more than a collection of organs with a slowly stopping metabolism. Two of them wanted to end it, but…

>I suppose the only accident, homicide, and disease that cannot be defeated given enough luck, research, and effort is the eventual tiring, erosion, and destruction of one's mind

I don't really see how you arrive at this. If someone has a disease that erodes their mind, they didn't die voluntarily, even if they choose euthanasia. In fact, you could say this about all euthanasia. Why choose to die? The HN answer is "because someone or something made me want to die".

If someone is bit by a tick and gets Lyme disease and signs up for euthanasia, then the tick has essentially killed you.

All effects that lead to voluntary euthanasia thereby become murder.

Now think one step further. Someone did something that causes another person to make someone want voluntary euthanasia. That is now also murder.

Notice something? That's a can of worms that society is not ready for yet. Since everything can lead to voluntary death, we must now make sure that society is such a good place that nobody ever wants to die. Society won't be that place, ever.

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#158

Post by winocm »

treis wrote: post #143
gnfargbl wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can listen to the account yourself at https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m00253mt , from around 25 minutes onwards. I found it convincing.

It doesn't sound particularly possible.

This is entirely possible. See copremesis, ICD10 code R11.13.

It usually occurs due to intestinal blockage or fistulae.

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#159

Post by jandrese »

graeme wrote: post #140
djoldman wrote: post #113

IMO, the key quote: > The vast majority – around 96% - had a death deemed "reasonably foreseeable", due to severe medical conditions such as cancer.

The standard for that is very loose. There's no requirement that the death be imminent. Iirc it basically means the condition could kill you, at some point. This even applies if treatment would prevent death. It's whether the condition is capable of killing.

With everything medical it is complicated. If someone is 85 and gets a theoretically treatable form of cancer they're looking at months or years of grueling chemotherapy and surgeries to get at most few more years of life.

I would not blame anybody for skipping treatment or even getting euthanasia to avoid the really sucky part where the cancer is killing you painfully, especially if their life partner has already passed.

Overall it is best to avoid making too many blanket judgements about medical matters. Every case is unique and the circumstances matter. Most people are sane and rational and you should trust their judgement when it comes to their own life, weighing also the opinion of their physician.

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